Trouble playing low

[claf]

Okay, I did not know how to call the topic, but the title is not that wrong...

For the context, I'm originally (and still) a trumpet player who fell in love with bass trombone a few years ago and who eventually also bought a tenor trombone because when I played the trombone in the orchestras I'm in, I'm most of the time alone in the trombone section.

Also for the context, I took a lesson with Doug 15 months ago and it was a huge enlightenment that gave me a lot of things to consider when practicing. My trumpet secure range and "I can play it when I'm not too tired" range both went up a few steps (D is now secure, E is almost secure, G and A can be played when not exhausted, whereas the D was before the highest I could play). My trombone sound developed a lot and my trombone range also went up quite a bit (I'm less experienced, but I'm very proud to have a reliable high D now).

The things that helped me do that:

- Mouthpiece diameter: went back to 1-1/2c on trumpet, same diameter for lead mouthpiece but shallower. Went to a DE XT103/G/G8 for my large bore tenor (XT103/C+/D2 for small bore). For the bass, I went up to a LB112/K/K8 but recently went back to a LB109 because it felt easier to play on a 1-1/2G-ish (did not affect the low range, opened the medium range).

- Jaw slightly forward: this is what allowed me to "use the tongue to channel the pitch". Not sure how to explain it, but my tongue has always been "firmly locked at the bottom of the mouth" it never affected pitch. It also led to valsalva maneuvre. Now that I worked on jaw and tongue both at the same time, it brought incredible results. Hope it makes sense.

- Pivot: I used to try to work on this a lot, never made sense, but after the previous jaw/tongue point was discovered, the pivot was unlocked. Doug diagnosed a "top left to ascend, bottom right to descend", so far I found it seems to be "very slightly top, more left to ascend" to be very efficient. It basically unlocked my tenor trombone playing and during my rehearsal today I enjoyed playing my 1st trombone part a lot and high notes (well, G/A, but still...) just felt secure, easy and beautiful.
However I do not have much success while going down (the pivot right or bottom right helps "a little", but it is far from the impact on the high range).

But now my problem.

While I always had a good low range on trumpet (I have quite a huge sound below the staff, even on the treacherous low F#).

My bass trombone range went down to a pedal G almost instantaneously when I first learnt the instrument but is still locked there (I'm talking about "practice room notes"), haven't practiced that specifically because I'm not playing that much bass trombone however.

And on the tenor trombone (which I played today), I find my tone beautiful and my notes secure from middle D up, but insecure and ugly from low C down. For example I had to play the 3rd trombone part (I'm the single trombone) of Peer Gynt - Hall of the Mountain King and it sounded awful.
I could easily fix that by using the bass trombone, or could blame the cup depth or single bore slide, but I'm pretty sure there is an issue in my playing.

Should I spend even more time on my pivot or something else? Should I consider a larger rim? Should I consider a deeper cup? Should I blame the violas? Should I stick to trumpet?

Sorry for the very long post and congratulations to the ones that read it and/or will reply to it. Beers are on me if we ever cross paths some day.

[Doug Elliott]

A short follow-up?
I can diagnose quickly if I see it.

[2bobone]

I once had a student who generally had problems in any range of the instrument. One day, when he arrived for his lesson, he played exceptionally well and I decided to investigate this anomaly with hopes that I might find the reason for this drastic change. It turned out that he'd "had a beer" with a friend just before his lesson. Eureka !! says I !!! We experimented over the next few weeks. Without exception, he played great after a bit of alcoholic reinforcement ! We've all known players who THOUGHT they played better after a nip or two but this guy really did perform better after a "relaxant". I've always thought that a considerable number of players are just too wrapped up with the anxieties involved with public performance and the demands of the instrument and that a relaxing experience would always provide a decent solution. I also hoped that I didn't accidently create an alcoholic by my actions, but the results really did speak for themselves. Come to think about it ----- it always worked pretty well for me !!

[VJOFan]

Inderal was the go to for a lot of my colleagues through the 80's and 90's. I guess anxiety is real, but I like to try to get relaxed non-chemically.

Now the specifics of playing low notes is likely different from general anxiety and should be addressed by something more than dispensing a pint or two.

Hopefully the OP took lesson notes that can be reviewed or has the resources to make another zoom call.

[claf]

I will indeed contact you Doug for a follow-up, thank you.

And no, it is not performance anxiety, I am lucky to not be prone to that.