Centered and edgy sound wanted

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bigbandbone
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Centered and edgy sound wanted

Post by bigbandbone » Fri May 17, 2019 10:49 am

I happily just bought my first bass bone. Wow, still can't believe it! A Yamaha 421 G. While I'm waiting for FedEx to place it gently on my doorstep it's time to start thinking about a mouthpiece. I test played the stock factory mouthpiece and want something different.

I'm looking for a mouthpiece that will help me get a centered and edgy sound. Definitely not looking for the typical symphonic sound. I will primarily be playing big band. Think about all the anonymous bass bone players in the big bands of the 70's, 80's, and 90's. Kenton, Rich, Maynard, Basie, Herman.

Any advice will be greatly appreciated!
Thanks
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Burgerbob
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Re: Centered and edgy sound wanted

Post by Burgerbob » Fri May 17, 2019 10:53 am

It comes with a Yamaha 58, I think. That should get the job done.
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BGuttman
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Re: Centered and edgy sound wanted

Post by BGuttman » Fri May 17, 2019 12:27 pm

... Or a Bach 1 1/2 G (not M, not Megatone). If 1 1/2 G or Yamaha 58 is a little too big, look at Bach 2G.
Bruce Guttman
Merrimack Valley Philharmonic Orchestra
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Posaunus
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Re: Centered and edgy sound wanted

Post by Posaunus » Fri May 17, 2019 12:31 pm

The Yamaha 58L (supplied with the YBL-421G) or Schilke 58 would be a good starting point - but apparently the Yamaha 58 doesn't meet your vision. Nevertheless, you might want to give it a chance, since it came free!

For Big Band use, I prefer my Marcinkiewicz "Geo Roberts" model. :good:
Bach5G
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Re: Centered and edgy sound wanted

Post by Bach5G » Fri May 17, 2019 12:40 pm

BGuttman wrote:
Fri May 17, 2019 12:27 pm
... Or a Bach 1 1/2 G (not M, not Megatone). If 1 1/2 G or Yamaha 58 is a little too big, look at Bach 2G.
Faxx 1 1/2G- Horn Guys, $40.
walldaja
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Re: Centered and edgy sound wanted

Post by walldaja » Fri May 17, 2019 1:00 pm

The Yamaha 58L that came with mine was a good starting point. I discovered that my 0.547 Courtois really responded and sounded better with the 58L. To get a better low end I got a Bach 1 1/2G and really like that combination. I really love my 421G, especially when I put a lot of air through it. Best wishes in finding a fit your like.
Dave

Antoine Courtois AC280BO with Christian Lindberg 4CL
Yamaha 421G Bass with Bach 1 1/2G
Getzen 351 Tenor with Yamaha 51D
1967 Olds Ambassador with Yamaha 48
Jean Baptiste EUPCOMS with Stork 4
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joebernie
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Re: Centered and edgy sound wanted

Post by joebernie » Fri May 17, 2019 1:40 pm

I've admittedly not played a Yamaha 58, but the specs compare more to a Bach 2G than a 1.5G (the oft-recommended starting size). I was happy with a Faxx 1.5G, I'm currently happier with a Yamaha 59, which is very slightly larger. I'd stick with the included mouthpiece for a bit since it's free, and you can make an informed purchase later.
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FeelMyRath
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Re: Centered and edgy sound wanted

Post by FeelMyRath » Fri May 17, 2019 2:51 pm

Wick 2AL
Making the world better, one note at a time

Yorkshire, United Kingdom
hyperbolica
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Re: Centered and edgy sound wanted

Post by hyperbolica » Fri May 17, 2019 4:23 pm

Ferguson V. Slightly bigger than a 1.5g, but a lot more spike in the note. Get it at hornguys, or here used sometimes. Horn guys says it's more "efficient", which means more sound per volume air.
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JohnL
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Re: Centered and edgy sound wanted

Post by JohnL » Fri May 17, 2019 4:41 pm

Sometimes a light blank makes it easier to put a little more "snap" in the sound. Maybe something like Marcinkiewicz 1.5 G or EBT3, or a Stork BT1.5 on a lightweight blank.
MrHCinDE
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Re: Centered and edgy sound wanted

Post by MrHCinDE » Mon May 20, 2019 10:10 am

I played a Marcinkiewicz EBT3 with my Yamaha 321 bass (forerunner of 421) for a while, mainly 4th part in big band.

I liked that combination for playability and sound in big band and I even still get some use out of the mouthpiece on tenor trombone in concert band so it was a good investment.

Having said that, would it not be worth sticking with the stock model for a bit to see if your sound changes? I notice if I play bass after mainly playing tenor for a few Months it sounds somewhat dull and unfocussed and it takes me at least a few days adjustment to have full control of the focus/brightness again. That‘s having played both instruments for many years in all different types of groups.
AndrewMeronek
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Re: Centered and edgy sound wanted

Post by AndrewMeronek » Mon May 20, 2019 1:40 pm

In my experience, bass bone in a big band is much more about how you play, not what you play. I've seen players who get a great big band bass bone sound play on any size from a Bach 3G to a Wick 00AL or even larger, for those who are more comfortable doing tuba doubling.

That said, my two favorite mouthpiece series are Wedge and Wick Heritage. Both are pricey, but if you have the funds and patience to buy several and sort out what works for you, they're well worth it. My current bass bone mouthpiece is the Wedge S59.
“All musicians are subconsciously mathematicians.”

- Thelonious Monk
JLivi
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Re: Centered and edgy sound wanted

Post by JLivi » Mon May 20, 2019 2:02 pm

The Yamaha 58 or Bach 1.5G will be a good starting point. From personal experience and watching other high school and college students go through the same thing, I found that the 58 & 1.5G are training wheelings, and it'll get you balanced, but you won't be able to go fast or move fast around corners.

I'm a big fan of the Schilke 59, and I currently play on a Hammond 20BXL (similar size to 59).

When you feel like the 58 has taken you as far as it can, give a bigger piece a try. You'll be shocked at how much it opens up the low end and makes it easier to play Low C's & pedals.
LIBrassCo
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Re: Centered and edgy sound wanted

Post by LIBrassCo » Tue May 21, 2019 2:05 am

AR Resonance made out of Phosphorus Bronze eill givevyou what you are looking for, and then some. Size will depend on preference. Personally ive scaled back to a BVL 72, but he makes an 80 with more of a U shaped cup for those that want it.
islander
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Re: Centered and edgy sound wanted

Post by islander » Tue May 21, 2019 3:02 am

Well, if you don't want a "symphonic" sound - and that's at least as much to do with what's going on in your head as your mouthpiece choice, and you also want to sound like those big band guys from the 60s onwards, then as others have pointed out, you have triangulated yourself at 1.5G. No need ever to move away from that size if it does what you want. Even modern big band music isn't all about pedals, and you need to think about the high stuff that you will need to play.

For every pedal G that's been required of me, I've needed to play 100 top Gs. As a rough guess.
Tbarh
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Re: Centered and edgy sound wanted

Post by Tbarh » Tue May 21, 2019 5:28 am

islander wrote:
Tue May 21, 2019 3:02 am
:good: Well, if you don't want a "symphonic" sound - and that's at least as much to do with what's going on in your head as your mouthpiece choice, and you also want to sound like those big band guys from the 60s onwards, then as others have pointed out, you have triangulated yourself at 1.5G. No need ever to move away from that size if it does what you want. Even modern big band music isn't all about pedals, and you need to think about the high stuff that you will need to play.

For every pedal G that's been required of me, I've needed to play 100 top Gs. As a rough guess.
:good: :good: :good:
hornbuilder
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Re: Centered and edgy sound wanted

Post by hornbuilder » Tue May 21, 2019 7:22 pm

Maybe you should consider learning to play "bass trombone" with the piece that came with the horn, (since it is a fairly middle of the road mouthpiece) before searching for the "magic bullet". If you haven't learned how the horn plays, it will not matter what mouthpiece you use.
Matthew Walker
Owner/Craftsman, M&W Custom Trombones, LLC
Bass Trombonist, Opera Australia, 1991-2006
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