Lawler trombones

mrdeacon
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Re: Lawler trombones

Post by mrdeacon » Thu Sep 06, 2018 7:08 pm

Sherrif, is the J bend fully continuous like a Williams J bend?

It's hard to tell but with the extra brace it seems like it would still disrupt the taper.

I have a Williams style J bend and my Minick bass and I absolutely love how it plays. I feel that I get the best of both worlds, continuous taper, and lighter weight slide, with it.
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Re: Lawler trombones

Post by TheSheriff » Fri Sep 07, 2018 6:43 am

mrdeacon wrote:
Thu Sep 06, 2018 7:08 pm
Sherrif, is the J bend fully continuous like a Williams J bend?

It's hard to tell but with the extra brace it seems like it would still disrupt the taper.

I have a Williams style J bend and my Minick bass and I absolutely love how it plays. I feel that I get the best of both worlds, continuous taper, and lighter weight slide, with it.
=====

The j-bend in the prototype was one continuous piece, but in doing so he had to make the instrument wider which is something he did not like. Making it wider was required because it was impossible to put a bend in the neck pipe area of the j-bend which would have been necessary to allow for an 8" flare.

So what he did is make it two piece, allowing him to put a traditional bend in the neck pipe which will then accommodate an 8" flare without being too close to your passing fingers. Importantly though, the taper is continuous (same as the prototype) because the neck pipe butts up to the tuning slide bow and is soldered or brazed, I don't know which, with absolutely no interruption in the continuous taper. The cross brace is brazed to heavy ferrules that fit around the tubing, so there is no interruption at all.

It's a beautiful design that plays beautifully. You are correct about getting the best of both worlds. The continuous taper of a TIS trombone bell section, but without the extra weight of a TIS hand slide. Brilliant!

------
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Re: Lawler trombones

Post by mrdeacon » Fri Sep 07, 2018 11:33 am

That's really smart! The Model 3 has me very intrigued!

Do you know if he plans to make his medium bore model also a J bend or is it a traditional tuning slide?
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Re: Lawler trombones

Post by TheSheriff » Fri Sep 07, 2018 2:22 pm

mrdeacon wrote:
Fri Sep 07, 2018 11:33 am
That's really smart! The Model 3 has me very intrigued!

Do you know if he plans to make his medium bore model also a J bend or is it a traditional tuning slide?
-------

The medium bore, which I am pretty sure he will call the model 4, will be a traditional reverse tuning slide just like the model 1 and 2, and it will be a set back bell like the model 2 and 3. The model 3 J-bend uses a non-reverse tuning slide. Roy did that for reasons of comfort. If he had made it a reverse tuning slide, the thumb of your left hand would likely come into contact with the gap that you have when you pull the tuning slide out to adjust to your base line pitch. Most of us are probably out about a 1/4 to a 1/2 inch, and you'd feel that gap rubbing on your thumb, so that is why the J-bend uses non-reverse tuning. Non-reverse tuning moves the tuning slide gap further up and out of the way of your left thumb.

I'm really excited to see how the medium bore turns out. Knowing Roy as I do, I am sure it will be fantastic.
Stay tuned.

======
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MalecHeermans
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Re: Lawler trombones

Post by MalecHeermans » Thu Sep 20, 2018 8:57 am

I'll post some thoughts soon, but in the meantime enjoy this little clip of the Lawler in action:

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Re: Lawler trombones

Post by TheSheriff » Thu Sep 20, 2018 1:18 pm

=======

Malec............Nice!

----------
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Re: Lawler trombones

Post by TheSheriff » Wed Oct 03, 2018 12:24 pm

------

Hey all,

I have been re-acquainting myself with Lawler leadpipes. For the longest time I have been using a Kanstul W6.

I have all three of the Lawler leadpipes; 5, 10, and 15. I have come to realize that the 10 pipe is the best one for me in my model 3. Better than my Kanstul W6 and a host of other pipes I have. The Lawler 15 seems to work best in my model 1, though the 10 ain't bad either. The 5 is too tight for the way I blow.

There must be a synergy in his tapers. Y'know, how they work together as a system; the tapers of the neckpipe, tuning slide crook, bell stem, and leadpipe.

The more I play his stuff, the more I realize he is a genius. My opinion only.

=====
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Re: Lawler trombones

Post by Davidus1 » Fri Oct 05, 2018 2:36 pm

TheSheriff wrote:
Fri Sep 07, 2018 2:22 pm
mrdeacon wrote:
Fri Sep 07, 2018 11:33 am
That's really smart! The Model 3 has me very intrigued!

Do you know if he plans to make his medium bore model also a J bend or is it a traditional tuning slide?
-------

The medium bore, which I am pretty sure he will call the model 4, will be a traditional reverse tuning slide just like the model 1 and 2, and it will be a set back bell like the model 2 and 3. The model 3 J-bend uses a non-reverse tuning slide. Roy did that for reasons of comfort. If he had made it a reverse tuning slide, the thumb of your left hand would likely come into contact with the gap that you have when you pull the tuning slide out to adjust to your base line pitch. Most of us are probably out about a 1/4 to a 1/2 inch, and you'd feel that gap rubbing on your thumb, so that is why the J-bend uses non-reverse tuning. Non-reverse tuning moves the tuning slide gap further up and out of the way of your left thumb.

I'm really excited to see how the medium bore turns out. Knowing Roy as I do, I am sure it will be fantastic.
Stay tuned.

======
Any ETA on the medium bore? Just curious when they might be available. Thanks.
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Re: Lawler trombones

Post by TheSheriff » Fri Oct 05, 2018 2:55 pm

Davidus1 wrote:
Fri Oct 05, 2018 2:36 pm
TheSheriff wrote:
Fri Sep 07, 2018 2:22 pm
mrdeacon wrote:
Fri Sep 07, 2018 11:33 am
That's really smart! The Model 3 has me very intrigued!

Do you know if he plans to make his medium bore model also a J bend or is it a traditional tuning slide?
-------

The medium bore, which I am pretty sure he will call the model 4, will be a traditional reverse tuning slide just like the model 1 and 2, and it will be a set back bell like the model 2 and 3. The model 3 J-bend uses a non-reverse tuning slide. Roy did that for reasons of comfort. If he had made it a reverse tuning slide, the thumb of your left hand would likely come into contact with the gap that you have when you pull the tuning slide out to adjust to your base line pitch. Most of us are probably out about a 1/4 to a 1/2 inch, and you'd feel that gap rubbing on your thumb, so that is why the J-bend uses non-reverse tuning. Non-reverse tuning moves the tuning slide gap further up and out of the way of your left thumb.

I'm really excited to see how the medium bore turns out. Knowing Roy as I do, I am sure it will be fantastic.
Stay tuned.

======
Any ETA on the medium bore? Just curious when they might be available. Thanks.
========

I think I'll have a prototype in my hands in the next couple months or so. He's still working on it. There will be no compatibility between the model 4 and the models 1, 2, or 3. It will be a stand alone .525. I will keep y'all posted, so please stay tuned.

------------
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Re: Lawler trombones

Post by Davidus1 » Fri Oct 05, 2018 3:56 pm

TheSheriff wrote:
Fri Oct 05, 2018 2:55 pm
Davidus1 wrote:
Fri Oct 05, 2018 2:36 pm
TheSheriff wrote:
Fri Sep 07, 2018 2:22 pm

-------

The medium bore, which I am pretty sure he will call the model 4, will be a traditional reverse tuning slide just like the model 1 and 2, and it will be a set back bell like the model 2 and 3. The model 3 J-bend uses a non-reverse tuning slide. Roy did that for reasons of comfort. If he had made it a reverse tuning slide, the thumb of your left hand would likely come into contact with the gap that you have when you pull the tuning slide out to adjust to your base line pitch. Most of us are probably out about a 1/4 to a 1/2 inch, and you'd feel that gap rubbing on your thumb, so that is why the J-bend uses non-reverse tuning. Non-reverse tuning moves the tuning slide gap further up and out of the way of your left thumb.

I'm really excited to see how the medium bore turns out. Knowing Roy as I do, I am sure it will be fantastic.
Stay tuned.

======
Any ETA on the medium bore? Just curious when they might be available. Thanks.
========

I think I'll have a prototype in my hands in the next couple months or so. He's still working on it. There will be no compatibility between the model 4 and the models 1, 2, or 3. It will be a stand alone .525. I will keep y'all posted, so please stay tuned.

------------
Thanks for the info! I'm primarily a .525 player anymore so I was happy to hear he is planning to produce one!
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Re: Lawler trombones

Post by Davidus1 » Fri Dec 21, 2018 7:27 pm

TheSheriff wrote:
Fri Oct 05, 2018 2:55 pm
Davidus1 wrote:
Fri Oct 05, 2018 2:36 pm
TheSheriff wrote:
Fri Sep 07, 2018 2:22 pm

-------

The medium bore, which I am pretty sure he will call the model 4, will be a traditional reverse tuning slide just like the model 1 and 2, and it will be a set back bell like the model 2 and 3. The model 3 J-bend uses a non-reverse tuning slide. Roy did that for reasons of comfort. If he had made it a reverse tuning slide, the thumb of your left hand would likely come into contact with the gap that you have when you pull the tuning slide out to adjust to your base line pitch. Most of us are probably out about a 1/4 to a 1/2 inch, and you'd feel that gap rubbing on your thumb, so that is why the J-bend uses non-reverse tuning. Non-reverse tuning moves the tuning slide gap further up and out of the way of your left thumb.

I'm really excited to see how the medium bore turns out. Knowing Roy as I do, I am sure it will be fantastic.
Stay tuned.

======
Any ETA on the medium bore? Just curious when they might be available. Thanks.
========

I think I'll have a prototype in my hands in the next couple months or so. He's still working on it. There will be no compatibility between the model 4 and the models 1, 2, or 3. It will be a stand alone .525. I will keep y'all posted, so please stay tuned.

------------
Any progress on this? Just curious if he's working on the .525 yet. I hear great things about his horns.
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Re: Lawler trombones

Post by TheSheriff » Sat Dec 22, 2018 7:57 am

------

Just a quick update on the Lawler .525. I should have a couple of prototypes in my hands after the first of the year. One will be a bell forward design like his model 1, and the other will be a set back bell like his model 2.

I'll be sure to post my review after I've spent some time with them.

-------
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Re: Lawler trombones

Post by Davidus1 » Sat Dec 22, 2018 9:04 am

TheSheriff wrote:
Sat Dec 22, 2018 7:57 am
------

Just a quick update on the Lawler .525. I should have a couple of prototypes in my hands after the first of the year. One will be a bell forward design like his model 1, and the other will be a set back bell like his model 2.

I'll be sure to post my review after I've spent some time with them.

-------
What's the difference in bell forward vs set back other than feedback to the player? Is there a difference in the sound the audience hears or just different to the player? Thanks for the update.
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Re: Lawler trombones

Post by TheSheriff » Sat Dec 22, 2018 9:21 am

------

The difference is feedback to the player. Naturally, there are subtle differences between bell forward and set back bell concerning overall feel of the instrument.

------
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Re: Lawler trombones

Post by TheSheriff » Mon Jan 14, 2019 7:26 am

-----

Another update. The model 4 .525 bore (BigBoy) will have compatibility with the .500 and .508 models. Originally, the model 4 was going to be a stand alone model, but after much thought, Roy decided to abandon that idea. And for what it's worth, I agree.

This means the same bell flares can be used and even the hand slides can be interchanged, which may or may not provide some interesting results.

Design wise, the main difference between the model 4 and the small bores, is that the model 4 will have a larger i.d. neck pipe and taper differences. Also, the hand slide will be a bit wider than the small bore hand slides.

I should have a couple of prototypes in my hands in about 3 weeks. I'm really looking forward to the BigBoy, and I have a feeling it's going to be a big hit!

====
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Re: Lawler trombones

Post by AndyBaker » Sat Jan 19, 2019 5:42 pm

Hi all,
I ordered my new Lawler model 1 last year after playing the Sheriff's - he's always been the guy I've trusted most about gear. It arrived on Wednesday - I was so happy, I played it on my big band gig that night.

I went for the package deal - 2 bells and a case. I think these are EXTREMELY good value for custom trombones (last I checked the Shires MD was somewhere north of $3500?)

My set-up:
Model 1 - 0.25 Yellow brass stem, nickel neck pipe
.500/.508 brass slide with a nickel crook
.22 yellow 8" flare
.25 red 7.5" flare

The craftsmanship is beautiful, and the SOUND - a real jazz trombone (as I expected after my first Lawler).

Happily the gig was recorded for later broadcast and the engineer gave me a rough mix there and then. I was playing the red bell (on lead), and I'm extremely happy with the way it sounded.
I tried to upload a clip, but unfortunately I can't add the attachment...

I'm sure I'll have more thoughts as time goes on, but this is a really great trombone.
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Re: Lawler trombones

Post by Davidus1 » Sun Jan 20, 2019 11:20 pm

Thanks for sharing. Glad you like the new horn. Enjoy!



AndyBaker wrote:
Sat Jan 19, 2019 5:42 pm
Hi all,
I ordered my new Lawler model 1 last year after playing the Sheriff's - he's always been the guy I've trusted most about gear. It arrived on Wednesday - I was so happy, I played it on my big band gig that night.

I went for the package deal - 2 bells and a case. I think these are EXTREMELY good value for custom trombones (last I checked the Shires MD was somewhere north of $3500?)

My set-up:
Model 1 - 0.25 Yellow brass stem, nickel neck pipe
.500/.508 brass slide with a nickel crook
.22 yellow 8" flare
.25 red 7.5" flare

The craftsmanship is beautiful, and the SOUND - a real jazz trombone (as I expected after my first Lawler).

Happily the gig was recorded for later broadcast and the engineer gave me a rough mix there and then. I was playing the red bell (on lead), and I'm extremely happy with the way it sounded.
I tried to upload a clip, but unfortunately I can't add the attachment...

I'm sure I'll have more thoughts as time goes on, but this is a really great trombone.
Conn Victor 5H
Yamaha YSL-630
Yamaha YSL-354
Miraphone 186 BBb
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Re: Lawler trombones

Post by TheSheriff » Tue Feb 26, 2019 10:48 am

TheSheriff wrote:
Mon Jan 14, 2019 7:26 am
-----

Another update. The model 4 .525 bore (BigBoy) will have compatibility with the .500 and .508 models. Originally, the model 4 was going to be a stand alone model, but after much thought, Roy decided to abandon that idea. And for what it's worth, I agree.

This means the same bell flares can be used and even the hand slides can be interchanged, which may or may not provide some interesting results.

Design wise, the main difference between the model 4 and the small bores, is that the model 4 will have a larger i.d. neck pipe and taper differences. Also, the hand slide will be a bit wider than the small bore hand slides.

I should have a couple of prototypes in my hands in about 3 weeks. I'm really looking forward to the BigBoy, and I have a feeling it's going to be a big hit!

====
-----

Update: The model 4 (.525) prototype is delayed, and hopefully it will not be much longer than another 4 weeks.

That is all.

====
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Re: Lawler trombones

Post by Mikebmiller » Tue Feb 26, 2019 2:38 pm

Roy is busier than a one legged man in a butt kicking contest right now. I have been waiting on a flair for 8 weeks. Hope to have it this week. He could probably sell 2 or three times as many horns as he does if if had some help in the shop.
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Re: Lawler trombones

Post by TheSheriff » Tue Feb 26, 2019 3:05 pm

Mikebmiller wrote:
Tue Feb 26, 2019 2:38 pm
Roy is busier than a one legged man in a butt kicking contest right now. I have been waiting on a flair for 8 weeks. Hope to have it this week. He could probably sell 2 or three times as many horns as he does if if had some help in the shop.
------

Roy has a build schedule, so waiting is part of the deal. A one man shop means total control of the build process, something that he believes in, and something that I believe is worth the wait because the final product is excellent.

=====
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Re: Lawler trombones

Post by Mikebmiller » Thu Feb 28, 2019 7:16 pm

Big news - Roy says my flair shipped today!
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Re: Lawler trombones

Post by jej » Tue Mar 05, 2019 11:48 am

I took delivery of my Lawler Model 1 a couple of weeks ago. Mine is a .22 yellow flare, all brass, with a .500 brass slide. Along with a .22 7.75" yellow flare and a .25 7.5" flair, I bought a .25 8.25 bronze flair that someone had ordered and ultimately not taken.
The horn blows great, and the various flares change the character quite a bit. I do find the slide just a bit noisy and wonder what other Lawler owners use as a slide lubricant. I mostly use the Yamaha stuff on every horn with great results, but wonder if the Lawler would benefit from something heavier. Or perhaps it just needs more of a breaking-in?
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Re: Lawler trombones

Post by CornyBone » Tue Mar 05, 2019 12:03 pm

jej wrote:
Tue Mar 05, 2019 11:48 am
I mostly use the Yamaha stuff on every horn with great results, but wonder if the Lawler would benefit from something heavier. Or perhaps it just needs more of a breaking-in?
I don't own a Lawler (next time I have a few grand, it's on the list) but it took my Shires slide about a month to break in, maybe even more. For really good slides, I always use the red-cap Slide-O-Mix stuff. It seems to keep my slides happy. I'm always a little speculative of all-in-one slide grease. I find having more control over your proportion of silicon to soap to water can help great slides become immaculate. If you want to try something heavier though, Trombotine has been the way to go for me. I use it on all my old instruments with a lot of wiggle room in the slide.
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Re: Lawler trombones

Post by dembones » Tue Mar 05, 2019 2:43 pm

jej wrote:
Tue Mar 05, 2019 11:48 am
I took delivery of my Lawler Model 1 a couple of weeks ago. Mine is a .22 yellow flare, all brass, with a .500 brass slide. Along with a .22 7.75" yellow flare and a .25 7.5" flair, I bought a .25 8.25 bronze flair that someone had ordered and ultimately not taken.
The horn blows great, and the various flares change the character quite a bit. I do find the slide just a bit noisy and wonder what other Lawler owners use as a slide lubricant. I mostly use the Yamaha stuff on every horn with great results, but wonder if the Lawler would benefit from something heavier. Or perhaps it just needs more of a breaking-in?
Congratulations on getting your Lawler. I have a couple of Lawler slides. They are fantastic - but they did take a while to break in. For the first couple of months or so, I cleaned them thoroughly a couple of times a week, using a cleaning rod and cheesecloth. You'll see some of the machining residue on the cloth especially at first. As I did this, each slide just got better and better.

As to the lube, I like the Yamasnot on them. I apply it to the outer slide - holding it almost horizontally but with the top tube on the bottom, then 2 drops into each outer tube. That way the fluid is coating what will be the top of each tube once it's being held normally. Works like a charm.
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Re: Lawler trombones

Post by TheSheriff » Tue Mar 05, 2019 5:56 pm

jej wrote:
Tue Mar 05, 2019 11:48 am
I took delivery of my Lawler Model 1 a couple of weeks ago. Mine is a .22 yellow flare, all brass, with a .500 brass slide. Along with a .22 7.75" yellow flare and a .25 7.5" flair, I bought a .25 8.25 bronze flair that someone had ordered and ultimately not taken.
The horn blows great, and the various flares change the character quite a bit. I do find the slide just a bit noisy and wonder what other Lawler owners use as a slide lubricant. I mostly use the Yamaha stuff on every horn with great results, but wonder if the Lawler would benefit from something heavier. Or perhaps it just needs more of a breaking-in?
===

Wipe, clean, swab, repeat. Use what lube you have, most will work just fine, though I can't get REKA to work on my Lawler slides. Pay attention to what the slide is telling you; they have a way of doing that and no two are alike. I have a .500 and a .500./.508 dual bore and they are both great, but a bit different in the action and needs department. Special needs for special slides or some such thing.......If after 4 to 6 weeks you aren't happy give Roy a call and he'll make it right.

===
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Re: Lawler trombones

Post by Mikebmiller » Wed Mar 06, 2019 9:25 am

I got mine in June and the slide is primo. I have been using SOM Rapid Comfort and I can go 4 hours or more without messing with it.
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Re: Lawler trombones

Post by Mikebmiller » Mon Mar 18, 2019 8:54 am

Does anyone else have trouble with the lock nut on their Lawler not staying tight? I was playing a gig Friday night and the bell would not stay tight to the slide no matter how hard I turned the nut. Is there some low level version of locktite I could use that would keep it tight but not so tight that I can't loosen it?
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Re: Lawler trombones

Post by BGuttman » Mon Mar 18, 2019 9:26 am

Mikebmiller wrote:
Mon Mar 18, 2019 8:54 am
Does anyone else have trouble with the lock nut on their Lawler not staying tight? I was playing a gig Friday night and the bell would not stay tight to the slide no matter how hard I turned the nut. Is there some low level version of locktite I could use that would keep it tight but not so tight that I can't loosen it?
If you put a paper shim on the slide tenon can you tighten it enough? If that's the case, you need to have somebody look at how the tenon fits in the receiver. The bell nut is not intended to lock the parts together; just to maintain the friction between the parts.
Bruce Guttman
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Re: Lawler trombones

Post by TheSheriff » Mon Mar 18, 2019 3:54 pm

Mikebmiller wrote:
Mon Mar 18, 2019 8:54 am
Does anyone else have trouble with the lock nut on their Lawler not staying tight? I was playing a gig Friday night and the bell would not stay tight to the slide no matter how hard I turned the nut. Is there some low level version of locktite I could use that would keep it tight but not so tight that I can't loosen it?
====

The problem is the nut making contact with the lower cork barrel. His slick design can pose this minor annoyance as the parts wear in a bit. Do not bother with teflon tape. It is not a tenon issue.

Roy suggests taking a flat wide file (rat file) and filing away material from the nut. It should not be a coarse file. If you don't feel comfortable doing that, take it to a tech. Plug the neckpipe with cloth or similar and then rinse well to remove any errant filings. I had to do it on my model 1. Easy. It was only a concern with my 500 slide, but my 500/508 did not have this issue. Filing the nut will create a larger gap between the nut and the lower cork barrel when it is properly cinched down.

====
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Re: Lawler trombones

Post by Dbone » Mon Apr 29, 2019 7:15 pm

Sheriff,

Which is your favorite Lawler trombone and why?
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Re: Lawler trombones

Post by johntarr » Mon Apr 29, 2019 10:59 pm

Is anyone using the carbon fiber slide with their Lawler? This seems like an interesting setup, if it sounds right.
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Re: Lawler trombones

Post by Mikebmiller » Tue Apr 30, 2019 6:49 am

TheSheriff wrote:
Mon Mar 18, 2019 3:54 pm
Mikebmiller wrote:
Mon Mar 18, 2019 8:54 am
Does anyone else have trouble with the lock nut on their Lawler not staying tight? I was playing a gig Friday night and the bell would not stay tight to the slide no matter how hard I turned the nut. Is there some low level version of locktite I could use that would keep it tight but not so tight that I can't loosen it?
====

The problem is the nut making contact with the lower cork barrel. His slick design can pose this minor annoyance as the parts wear in a bit. Do not bother with teflon tape. It is not a tenon issue.

Roy suggests taking a flat wide file (rat file) and filing away material from the nut. It should not be a coarse file. If you don't feel comfortable doing that, take it to a tech. Plug the neckpipe with cloth or similar and then rinse well to remove any errant filings. I had to do it on my model 1. Easy. It was only a concern with my 500 slide, but my 500/508 did not have this issue. Filing the nut will create a larger gap between the nut and the lower cork barrel when it is properly cinched down.

====
Thanks Sheriff. I took it to my tech yesterday after a Sunday rehearsal where I spent half my time realigning my bell and slide. I hope that simple fix works.
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Re: Lawler trombones

Post by Mikebmiller » Tue Apr 30, 2019 6:50 am

johntarr wrote:
Mon Apr 29, 2019 10:59 pm
Is anyone using the carbon fiber slide with their Lawler? This seems like an interesting setup, if it sounds right.
I tied the CF slide when I went to Roy's place. It is ridiculously light. You barely even feel it. But I liked the nickel slide better for sound and didn't feel like spending another $400, so I went with that.
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Re: Lawler trombones

Post by TheSheriff » Tue Apr 30, 2019 7:13 am

Dbone wrote:
Mon Apr 29, 2019 7:15 pm
Sheriff,

Which is your favorite Lawler trombone and why?
------

The model 3 with a 500/508 dual bore suits me best. I use a Lawler #10 leadpipe in it. It has a big open blow yet still has that quick response and beautiful center to the sound that I really like about his horns.
The bell section is entirely red brass including the j-bend, and the stem is .022 red. The slide is all yellow brass. My favorite flare is an .025 bronze 8". It has a gorgeous sound but less punchy than an all yellow bell section/stem with a nickle hand slide.

Naturally, some will prefer his other models or the model 3 with a 500 or 508 bore slide. Honestly I'm happy with all of his models, but simply prefer the model 3 for where I am at as a player at this stage of my life.

When I was much younger and a working pro playing hundreds and hundreds of gigs as a lead player, I'd probably have chosen a model 1 or model 2 with a 500 bore slide.

====
Lawler model 1
Lawler model 2
Lawler Model 3
Williams 6
Williams L
Kanstul 1606
Conn 71H
TheSheriff
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Re: Lawler trombones

Post by TheSheriff » Tue Apr 30, 2019 7:27 am

johntarr wrote:
Mon Apr 29, 2019 10:59 pm
Is anyone using the carbon fiber slide with their Lawler? This seems like an interesting setup, if it sounds right.
------

I tried it and did not like it at all. Not my kind of sound.

====
Lawler model 1
Lawler model 2
Lawler Model 3
Williams 6
Williams L
Kanstul 1606
Conn 71H
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Re: Lawler trombones

Post by johntarr » Fri May 03, 2019 2:49 pm

Is there anybody in the Denver, Colorado metro area with a Lawler that I could try when I’m visiting family in June? I live in Sweden so having one shipped without trying wouldn’t be ideal for me.
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Re: Lawler trombones

Post by jawbone62 » Sun May 05, 2019 5:15 am

Do any of you Lawler enthusiasts have observations re mouthpiece choice for the small bore range?
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Re: Lawler trombones

Post by TheSheriff » Sun May 05, 2019 6:45 am

jawbone62 wrote:
Sun May 05, 2019 5:15 am
Do any of you Lawler enthusiasts have observations re mouthpiece choice for the small bore range?
------

We're all different. The usual sizes....12C, 11C, 7C, 6 3/4, 6 1/2. I tend to like cups that are more v-like such as a Stork T2.

Leadpipe choice is important too.

------
Lawler model 1
Lawler model 2
Lawler Model 3
Williams 6
Williams L
Kanstul 1606
Conn 71H
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DaveAshley
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Re: Lawler trombones

Post by DaveAshley » Sun May 05, 2019 9:49 pm

jawbone62 wrote:
Sun May 05, 2019 5:15 am
Do any of you Lawler enthusiasts have observations re mouthpiece choice for the small bore range?
I have found my Model 1 to be more finicky about leadpipes than mouthpieces. Like Sheriff, I use a Kanstul W6 leadpipe. The Kanstul S is a pretty good match as well. At first, I used either a Lawler 10 or a Kanstul H6, and the 3rd partial and below just wouldn't speak the way I needed it to. I even began to consider the possibility that the horn wasn't going to work for me. Once I tried the Kanstul S and W6, those concerns went away.
I must say I haven't experimented much with mouthpieces since I got the W6 leadpipe. I play on a custom-made AR Resonance mouthpiece with the shorter A.K. (Alan Kaplan) backbore. For me, the A.K. works better than the standard backbore on the Lawler.
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Re: Lawler trombones

Post by Mikebmiller » Thu May 09, 2019 3:02 pm

Mikebmiller wrote:
Tue Apr 30, 2019 6:49 am
TheSheriff wrote:
Mon Mar 18, 2019 3:54 pm

====

The problem is the nut making contact with the lower cork barrel. His slick design can pose this minor annoyance as the parts wear in a bit. Do not bother with teflon tape. It is not a tenon issue.

Roy suggests taking a flat wide file (rat file) and filing away material from the nut. It should not be a coarse file. If you don't feel comfortable doing that, take it to a tech. Plug the neckpipe with cloth or similar and then rinse well to remove any errant filings. I had to do it on my model 1. Easy. It was only a concern with my 500 slide, but my 500/508 did not have this issue. Filing the nut will create a larger gap between the nut and the lower cork barrel when it is properly cinched down.

====
Thanks Sheriff. I took it to my tech yesterday after a Sunday rehearsal where I spent half my time realigning my bell and slide. I hope that simple fix works.

Update - I got that lock nut filed down and my horn still slips. Anything else I can try?
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Re: Lawler trombones

Post by TheSheriff » Thu May 09, 2019 3:57 pm

Mikebmiller wrote:
Thu May 09, 2019 3:02 pm
Mikebmiller wrote:
Tue Apr 30, 2019 6:49 am


Thanks Sheriff. I took it to my tech yesterday after a Sunday rehearsal where I spent half my time realigning my bell and slide. I hope that simple fix works.

Update - I got that lock nut filed down and my horn still slips. Anything else I can try?
------

Is there a visible gap when fully tightened down? If not, then more needs to be filed. If there is a gap and it still moves on you then call Roy.

------
Lawler model 1
Lawler model 2
Lawler Model 3
Williams 6
Williams L
Kanstul 1606
Conn 71H
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MahlerMusic
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Re: Lawler trombones

Post by MahlerMusic » Thu May 09, 2019 4:33 pm

Figured this belonged here. Nice review and wow, nice sound.






Badgerm
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Re: Lawler trombones

Post by Badgerm » Fri May 10, 2019 11:18 am

TheSheriff,

Did you get your Lawlers lacquered or did you leave them raw?
Mikebmiller
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Re: Lawler trombones

Post by Mikebmiller » Fri May 10, 2019 12:43 pm

TheSheriff wrote:
Thu May 09, 2019 3:57 pm
Mikebmiller wrote:
Thu May 09, 2019 3:02 pm



Update - I got that lock nut filed down and my horn still slips. Anything else I can try?
------

Is there a visible gap when fully tightened down? If not, then more needs to be filed. If there is a gap and it still moves on you then call Roy.

------
Yes, there is a gap now. I guess I will email Roy and see what he says.
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Re: Lawler trombones

Post by Mikebmiller » Fri May 10, 2019 12:44 pm

Badgerm wrote:
Fri May 10, 2019 11:18 am
TheSheriff,

Did you get your Lawlers lacquered or did you leave them raw?
Brushed finish on a Lawler is beautiful. Way better than lacquer IMHO.
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Re: Lawler trombones

Post by TheSheriff » Fri May 10, 2019 1:39 pm

Badgerm wrote:
Fri May 10, 2019 11:18 am
TheSheriff,

Did you get your Lawlers lacquered or did you leave them raw?
=====

Lacquer.

=====
Lawler model 1
Lawler model 2
Lawler Model 3
Williams 6
Williams L
Kanstul 1606
Conn 71H
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Re: Lawler trombones

Post by TheSheriff » Fri May 10, 2019 1:43 pm

Mikebmiller wrote:
Fri May 10, 2019 12:44 pm
Badgerm wrote:
Fri May 10, 2019 11:18 am
Brushed finish on a Lawler is beautiful. Way better than lacquer IMHO.
------

The brushed finish is his normal finish and you choose to have it lacquered or left raw (no lacquer). Most folks choose lacquer. I have a bronze brushed flare that is raw and it developed a patina rather quickly, and happens to sound great to boot.

=====
Lawler model 1
Lawler model 2
Lawler Model 3
Williams 6
Williams L
Kanstul 1606
Conn 71H
PaulT
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Re: Lawler trombones

Post by PaulT » Fri May 10, 2019 2:21 pm

This is a "can't hurt even if it is useless advice just in case tip" concerning the slide/bell slippage (and is a reiteration of BGuttman's advice)

I had bell/slide slippage issues with one my horns. When I asked the repair fellow at the shop I frequent, he explained that the nut wasn't intended to hold the two sections tight, just to provide insurance (and reassurance). He said the slide/bell interface was a tapered shaft, just like the mouthpiece/receiver interface. Fit the two sections together 180 degrees (flat) and rotate the slide to 90 degrees (or wherever it is you want it to be. The rotation will tighten the connection. If the pieces are milled right, the fit will be so secure the nut is superfluous to the hold.

I didn't know this. It solved the problem perfectly! (I had been thinking about equipping my stash bag with pliers)

If this proves to be the case in your situation, the caution is to keep your mouthpiece lessons in mind, rotate to tighten, but don't crank the sucker with so much pressure you need a crowbar to take the horn apart. Think "lightly snug", not "UMMPH %$##@ !!!".
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Re: Lawler trombones

Post by keybone » Sat May 11, 2019 10:42 am

PaulT wrote:
Fri May 10, 2019 2:21 pm
When I asked the repair fellow at the shop I frequent, he explained that the nut wasn't intended to hold the two sections tight, just to provide insurance (and reassurance). He said the slide/bell interface was a tapered shaft, just like the mouthpiece/receiver interface. Fit the two sections together 180 degrees (flat) and rotate the slide to 90 degrees (or wherever it is you want it to be. The rotation will tighten the connection. If the pieces are milled right, the fit will be so secure the nut is superfluous to the hold.
This worked perfectly. Good, snug fit! Thank you!
Question - if I tighten the bell/slide in this manner on a daily basis, will there be some wear to the connection?
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BGuttman
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Re: Lawler trombones

Post by BGuttman » Sat May 11, 2019 10:47 am

keybone wrote:
Sat May 11, 2019 10:42 am
...
Question - if I tighten the bell/slide in this manner on a daily basis, will there be some wear to the connection?
In a sense, yes. But it will take decades for it to be enough wear that you will need to do something about it.
Bruce Guttman
Merrimack Valley Philharmonic Orchestra
"Almost Professional"
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