TromboneChat

Saw this photo as a suggested post on FB. I do not recall the orchestra, but I’m fairly certain that it was European.

Looks as though a piston valve is being used to engage the F attachment like on some old Conns and such on the (2nd?) trombonists horn.

Looks like a Bach with a Hoelle tuning slide. The piston would all be aftermarket.

The trombone player is Matthias Fischer from the Münchner Philharmoniker. I remember seeing that picture as well. Attached is a picture with a better view of the valve. I'm guessing it has to do with ergonomics?


EDIT: Just found the clip again of the trombones of the Münchner Philharmoniker playing some Bruckner near Bruckner's sarcophagus:

Interesting! Also with a nice-looking grip support, certainly for some ergonomic reasons.

If it works at the Munich Phiharmonic, then it cannot be too bad!

BTW:
a) The first trombonist on the pictures is Jonathon Ramsay, who just won second price at the ARD competition. You can find some great recordings by him on Youtube
b) On a less positive note, check out Abbie Conant's experience with the Munich Phil, e.g.: http://www.osborne-conant.org/ladies.htm It is some decades ago, but certainly still relevant. Even assuming that these sexist mindsets and behaviors are gone today at this orchestra, it's good to remember not to fall back into them

There used to be a Bach 42 with a piston valve to actuate the attachment. I never saw one in the field, only in catalogs.

At one time there were French Horns made with double length piston valves (they were double horns). Again, they seem to have fallen to the conventional rotor. Don't know if it was cost or convenience.

It's possible he has an injury, but even if that's not the case this looks great - your thumb is freed up from the lever and can contribute more to holding the horn. Your wrist can be straight instead of slightly bent. Your index finger is a much more capable finger for operating a valve. You can do a trill, for instance.

BGuttman wrote: Fri Dec 23, 2022 6:48 amAt one time there were French Horns made with double length piston valves (they were double horns). Again, they seem to have fallen to the conventional rotor. Don't know if it was cost or convenience.

Those were true French horns (i.e. actually from France), with a small bore and bell throat. Absolutely gorgeous instruments and it's a dream of mine to own one. They used them in France for most of the 20th century and then moved to more typical German-design rotor horns. As far as I know it was a sound thing, not cost or convenience (or the type of valve).

There was a German company that was doing these aftermarket conversions a long time ago. I saved these pics in 2000.

The double valve is a thing of beauty.
Cheers,
Andy

Towards the end of the video is a very quick look at the hand grip - his palm is facing his left eye, rather than facing down/right. Looks like a similar grip to what the Schagerl Superbone (3 left-hand rotories) uses, just with one finger.

elmsandr wrote: Fri Dec 23, 2022 10:42 am There was a German company that was doing these aftermarket conversions a long time ago. I saved these pics in 2000.

The double valve is a thing of beauty.

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Cheers,
Andy

I remember that one…It was using Nirschl piston valves ..Wonder how pistons blow on a trombone compared to rotary.. ??

I think Helmut Voigt in Germany made such piston F att. trombone till recently...
Not on their internet site any longer...

https://helmut-voigt.com/

I think it's name is Trevor. Trevor Trombone Jr.