TromboneChat

Ever since I borrowed (it was too expensive for me at the time) a wonderful 3B Silversonic, from a since long closed instrument shop in Stockholm, I have really liked playing Sterling silver horns. I get a more solid, pronounced feeling and a better sense of my projection and articulation from playing a Sterling bell, and I feel more comfortable in the upper and really high registers, as well as in louder dynamics. To me there are only advantages - this far, and from what I have played and tried.

Now my Sterling silver spree gets it's official addition, by me finally making the total instalment for a very nice, not much played, Conn 62H prototype in Sterling silver. From what the previous owner knows, it was made for some promotional event around 2000-2002. It has some wear and marks on the bell and outer slide, and some marks on the valve paddle, but over all this trombone can't have been played very much.

It has Lindberg valves, a dual bore slide (probably 0.562-0.xxx), what seems to be gold brass in the tuning crooks and some valve tubings, maybe a rose brass or at least some copper rich alloy in the slide, and what seems to be a NiSi slide crook. I haven't found much info on the horn, so I really have no idea of the alloys used more than for the bell.

The bell is 25cm, or about 9.84 inch, without any engravings - which suits me fine, since I like the more modest "art deco" apperance. The previous owner sold it with a modified King 50 case, but I have an Accord flight case on order, coming in soon. It turned out that the lead pipe reciever wasn't Remington taper (it was my previous mouthpiece that had poor tolerances from production), and I recently changed from 1 1/2G to something closer to 1 1/4G, which suits me much better.

Here are the pics. My spontaneous reaction when I first played it, was to call this horn "Betsy". I know it's somewhat silly to name an instrument, but some have characteristics that make them individuals and personal, and this trombone has that. So "Betsy" it is:







A big Thank You! to Doug Bert from the Brass Exchange, who provided much assistance and help to my knowledge of this horn.

That sure is a beauty!

Congrats! This horn is super rare and one of the best ever made

WOW. Just WOW.

Digidog wrote: Wed Dec 14, 2022 2:26 am
My spontaneous reaction when I first played it, was to call this horn "Betsy". I know it's somewhat silly to name an instrument, but some have characteristics that make them individuals and personal, and this trombone has that. So "Betsy" it is!

Congratulations.
Betsy is an apt name for such a beautiful trombone.
My dad named his Model T Ford "Betsy!"

Interestingly your horn has a soldered on bell. My prototype came with interchangeable bells, one 9.85“ sterling silver the other 10.5“ yellow brass.

Thanks for all the cheers, everybody!

meine wrote: Thu Dec 15, 2022 12:54 pm Interestingly your horn has a soldered on bell. My prototype came with interchangeable bells, one 9.85“ sterling silver the other 10.5“ yellow brass.

Strange that they built modular on - at least - one horn, and fixed on another. Is that useful? Maybe these prototyes were built for specific Conn artists, who could throw in requests for certain specifications? Does your horn have a "red brass" slide and main tuning crook? All other tuning crooks seem to be yellow brass, while the slide crook looks like being NiSi.

Is there any way of getting in touch with Conn? To maybe get more info on materials and measurements - especially on the slide reciever and the leadpipe. I have tried Conn-Selmer's web page, but that is as informative as a demented parrot; only addressing customers and dealers with prefabricated answers from a poorly functioning online answering machine - it's so 2009!

I had one of the prototypes, courtesy of Steve Dillon, in NY. Monster horn. 10.5 yellow bell, dual In-line Lindbergs, and a 562-578 slide. I used my Mt Vernon 1.5g on it. It played great. Wasn’t the air hog you might think.

Fridge

Which one of those was used on the Lindberg trombone choir CD?

Didgidog and meine, those are both beautiful horns. I hope you both sound as nice on them as they look!

Fridge wrote: Thu Dec 15, 2022 2:34 pm I had one of the prototypes, courtesy of Steve Dillon, in NY. Monster horn. 10.5 yellow bell, dual In-line Lindbergs, and a 562-578 slide. I used my Mt Vernon 1.5g on it. It played great. Wasn’t the air hog you might think.

Fridge

My slide is dual-bore, do you think it could be gauged 0.562-0.578? Nobody I've asked - this far - have known any measurements, and I haven't yet had the time to hand the horn in to a tech for some TLC and measuring.

harrisonreed wrote: Thu Dec 15, 2022 3:18 pm Which one of those was used on the Lindberg trombone choir CD?

The guy I bought my horn from actually had two of these; one he sold some recent time ago, and the one that I now bought. Since I believe it was he who played on the recording, and depending on where Meine got his horn, it would most likely be my horn in combination with that other he had at the time. If that other horn turns out to be Meine's, the answer is both. I'll ask this afternoon, when I see him.

Kbiggs wrote: Thu Dec 15, 2022 3:26 pm Didgidog and meine, those are both beautiful horns. I hope you both sound as nice on them as they look!

Thanks!

I'm not primarily a bass trombonist, though I get more and more bass gigs. I have doubled on a Yamaha (first a borrowed 321 and then an owned 421) for something close to twenty years now, and I practise diligently at least three days a week - more if there are gigs coming up. I really like playing the bass, and I feel it significantly benefits both my alto and tenor chops.

The handslide of these prototypes are .562-.580. Mine had a yellow brass handslide and red brass main tuning slide. Was a monster to play.
I found it at Brass Specialisten in Sweden after he posted it on fb in 2018. So I guess he had 2 of these rarities. Anyway I bought because I always wanted a sterling silver bell on my bass trombone. So I robbed it from the prototype to fit my Thein and sold the prototype on with the yellow bell. To sell it on wasn‘t a good desicion as I want it back. Just the owner don‘t want to sell it back to me

The guy from Conn wouldn’t tell me. He brought me a couple of different slides on a Diane Moser’s Composers big band gig one night. Had me trade out slides over a couple of sets. The duo bore worked better than the single bores they had.

Fridge

I tried to contact Conn on their chat, but the guy didn‘t even know they made some prototypes of the 62H

I have to hand in my horn to a tech, to get some measurements done and give the instrument some TLC.

Is there no way of getting in touch with Conn, besides their incredibly stupid auto-chat?

Maybe a tec using Conn parts has a contact. Otherwise I have no idea

I have had some good luck identifying a "Bach Soloist TBSOL210" and other horns, by looking/comparing part #'s that are used in different make/models of other Conn-Selmer items. Good luck!
https://parts.conn-selmer.com/products/ ... 2hcl/62hcl

flotrb wrote: Tue Dec 20, 2022 7:20 am I have had some good luck identifying a "Bach Soloist TBSOL210" and other horns, by looking/comparing part #'s that are used in different make/models of other Conn-Selmer items. Good luck!
https://parts.conn-selmer.com/products/ ... 2hcl/62hcl

Thanks for the link! It was helpful in many ways.

Digidog wrote: Mon Dec 19, 2022 11:19 pm I have to hand in my horn to a tech, to get some measurements done and give the instrument some TLC.

Is there no way of getting in touch with Conn, besides their incredibly stupid auto-chat?

That horn may have been made before / during the UMI / Conn-Selmer merger, so if there is anyone who remembers or any records, they may not exist at Conn anymore.

I know two players who had custom Conn 62H's built with Lindberg valves from the Eastlake factory, and one of them may very well have been the previous owner of this one with the sterling bell. I know that he left his orchestra job and probably no longer plays.

Anyway, in both cases I believe the prototypes were designed - and probably primarily built - by Chuck Ward, who is no longer with Conn-Selmer. He is reachable though: https://www.chuckwardbrass.com/about-chuck-ward/

GabrielRice wrote: Tue Dec 20, 2022 3:07 pm I know two players who had custom Conn 62H's built with Lindberg valves from the Eastlake factory, and one of them may very well have been the previous owner of this one with the sterling bell. I know that he left his orchestra job and probably no longer plays.

Anyway, in both cases I believe the prototypes were designed - and probably primarily built - by Chuck Ward, who is no longer with Conn-Selmer. He is reachable though: https://www.chuckwardbrass.com/about-chuck-ward/

This is very helpful. Thank you!

The guy I bought my horn from, got it (as far as I know) new from Conn in connection with some Christian Lindberg-event or release. At the time he got two, and from what Meine has told here, he sold the other of those to Meine in, like, 2018. The owner then sat on "my horn" until now, when he finally decided to sell it to me.

I'll reach out to Chuck, to see if he can provide some more info. Especially on the leadpipe and the slide bores.

The ones I know of happened earlier than that - more like early 2000s.

I think these might be post Chuck Ward, I think he was already gone from UMI by 2000, and were the work of Stan Matras, who succeeded Chuck as chief instrument designer at UMI/Conn Selmer

The horn I had was given to me around 2004, I think. It was a blank bell. No engraving. The only writing was on the Lindberg valve caps. Yes, I knew it was a Conn, but they tried to keep all other details in the dark so nobody had any preconceived ideas.

Fridge

Fridge wrote: Wed Dec 21, 2022 8:16 am The horn I had was given to me around 2004, I think. It was a blank bell. No engraving. The only writing was on the Lindberg valve caps. Yes, I knew it was a Conn, but they tried to keep all other details in the dark so nobody had any preconceived ideas.

Fridge

Do you still have it?

GabrielRice wrote: Wed Dec 21, 2022 7:17 am The ones I know of happened earlier than that - more like early 2000s.

Yeah, the guy I told about got his two 62H:s sometime in the early 2000's; he wasn't too sure about the years, hence my vague - and confused - recaps of the events. Meine bought his horn around 2018, so the original owner of these two horns, sat on them for quite some time before deciding to sell them.

Did you get them from Lars Westergren? He would have had at least one in 2000, for the recordings. The CL valve itself doesn't go back much further than 1996, where the first prototype appeared. The "New Valve Design"

Yes and he had two of them. I found the mail where he mentioned he had two. What an idiot I was not to buy the second one too

Tuning slide looks nice and short on that 62H, too. Just noticed that.

Mystery solved though, meine and digidog have both of the protypes from Lars, probably both used on the trombone sextet recording from 2000.

Interestingly Conn made some different bells not even in the diameter but in the gauge too?

In the early 2000s Conn was poised to up its game and really start offering some special stuff. I think they even had greenhoe models advertised on their site. Then ... They stopped.

I don't know if it was because CL backed off the promotion and kind of backed off solo performances for a while or what happened.

harrisonreed wrote: Thu Dec 22, 2022 3:12 pm In the early 2000s Conn was poised to up its game and really start offering some special stuff. I think they even had greenhoe models advertised on their site. Then ... They stopped.

I don't know if it was because CL backed off the promotion and kind of backed off solo performances for a while or what happened.

Pretty sure the Conn-Greenhoes were offered until Gary closed up shop. I owned one.

To answer the question, no, I don’t have it anymore. Sold it about 10 years ago. Wish I had kept it.

Fridge

Well, I've tried to get in touch with Chuck Ward through his web page, but the contact form seems to be not working.

I have to hand the horn to a tech to get some measurements done. It would be nice to have some extra leadpipes to switch between and experiment with, and - if so - it seems like I have to have them custom made.

I asked Chuck about the 36H leadpipe one time. He gave me a lot of insight about how that horn was designed. But for the pipe, he only said that it was correct.