WTB Dent Balls and Knuckle Rods

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olivegreenink
Posts: 44
Joined: Mon Jul 13, 2020 3:33 pm

WTB Dent Balls and Knuckle Rods

Post by olivegreenink » Fri Jul 31, 2020 4:15 am

Here is another case of considering going ahead a getting a tool so I have it for future stuff.

I’ve mentioned on here, I’ve been going though a restoration of a vintage trumpet. After many years out of the game, I decided the pandemic was a good chance to look at getting back into repairing. I used to do this in a very self-taught (i.e., wrong) way in the 90s and I’ve been trying to pactice and learn as I revisit this hobby. I am very happy with this trumpet - warts and all - except for this these two dents in the second valve tuning slide that stare me in the face every time I look at the horn. So, wondering if any of the kind folks on here have an extra few dent balls and a rod or two rolling around somewhere. I’m more than happy to place another order with Ferree (N80A or N80B + N54x)...but a big fan of reusing if possible. And, since my need at the moment is to fix this one thing, I’m open to getting only the tool I need now for this tuning slide and expending the set later.

Cheers,
BO

PS, I am not really looking to do this quite yet necessarily, but if someone has an extra things like dent hammer and dent roller I may be interested for down the road

PPS, I don’t know if this even needs to be said, but I’m an advocate of using certified techs (see my thread about the 354 that was damaged in shipping). I’ve been reading a ton of older posts since rejoining the group and folks’ trying to haphazardly “avoid” sending to a tech is a clear hot button. This for me is about learning some of the skills and taking time to try to do it at least “more correctly.” I’m confident I can do this silly tuning slide with the correct tools...and this would be another baby step on my way...but I know my limits.
Crazy4Tbone86
Posts: 239
Joined: Tue Jan 14, 2020 10:52 am

Re: WTB Dent Balls and Knuckle Rods

Post by Crazy4Tbone86 » Sat Aug 01, 2020 9:19 am

Hi Olivegreenink,

My recommendation is to go ahead and buy those specific tools from Ferree's. Those knuckle dent tools are absolute staples for brass repair techs. I used my knuckle dent tools about 5-6 times on trumpet crook dents in the last week alone and I am only a part-time tech.

My point is....it is very unlikely that an active repair tech is going to sell those particular tools because it is their bread and butter. Also, I doubt that a retiring tech would sell those tools individually. Usually shops that are closing sell tools in larger lots.

Those tools are so inexpensive that they will pay for themselves in two or three uses. Why wait? Those dents are talking to you right now and saying "buy the tools please!"
Brian D. Hinkley - Player, Teacher, Technician and Trombone Enthusiast
olivegreenink
Posts: 44
Joined: Mon Jul 13, 2020 3:33 pm

Re: WTB Dent Balls and Knuckle Rods

Post by olivegreenink » Sun Aug 02, 2020 10:16 am

Thank you for the encouragement. If I may ask then, what would you recommend I start with knowing I’m going to probably focus on trumpets for repair for right now? I’m a big believer in having the right tools, but also not really prepared to invest a boatload on it at the moment. I need to sell a few more things (Including my current restoration) before I buy too much more.

For example, what is the minimum number of dent balls I could get away with at this stage to address the crooks?

Also, could the P50 be used for the bell crook and main tuning slide, or would that require a P55 as well?

Thank you - and if the advice is to reach out to Ferree again directly, I can. :)

Cheers

PS, hopefully my floundering around on this topic isn’t too annoying for the professionals. :)
Crazy4Tbone86
Posts: 239
Joined: Tue Jan 14, 2020 10:52 am

Re: WTB Dent Balls and Knuckle Rods

Post by Crazy4Tbone86 » Mon Aug 03, 2020 10:20 pm

Hi olivegreenink,

I'll try my best to answer your questions....

To address the dents in trumpet valve tuning slide crooks, the Ferree's N54S Rods plus the N80AS threaded balls will take care of about 75-80% of the problems. There are some tough spots in the third valve slide crook that will require a set of dent balls. Occasionally there is a spot on a first valve slide crook that will need a dent ball set.

The P50 is designed for the trumpet bell stem bend. This tool is useless without a full set of dent balls. There is also something called a Roth dent tool that is effective in remove dents from the same area of a trumpet (see below). The Roth dent tool also requires a full set of dent balls.

The P55 is designed for the main tuning slide of a trumpet (not the bell stem). You can survive without this tool because many people simply use one of the drivers that are included in a dent ball set.

Having a dent ball set is useless without a good dent hammer. One of my favorite dent hammers is the Ferree's F10A. Remember to use sideways hammer strikes on the dent work to avoid work-hardening the brass. Straight on hammer strikes from a 90 degree angle will harden the metal very quickly

Whereas I earlier advised you to not look for a set of N54S rods in the used market. There are some repair tools that I DO recommend that you look for in the "used" market. Those items are: Full dent ball set and Roth dent tool. I occasionally see these items for sale in different online formats.
Brian D. Hinkley - Player, Teacher, Technician and Trombone Enthusiast
olivegreenink
Posts: 44
Joined: Mon Jul 13, 2020 3:33 pm

Re: WTB Dent Balls and Knuckle Rods

Post by olivegreenink » Tue Aug 04, 2020 12:42 am

Thank you so very much!

I will look this over and plan my purchases accordingly (perhaps over time) :)

Cheers
olivegreenink
Posts: 44
Joined: Mon Jul 13, 2020 3:33 pm

Re: WTB Dent Balls and Knuckle Rods

Post by olivegreenink » Tue Aug 11, 2020 7:00 am

As an update, bought the proper Knuckle tools From Ferree and happy to say I got the dents out of the tuning slide crook :)

Thanks so much
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