TromboneChat

Hello everyone,

I'm looking to buy a good medium bore trombone with f attachment.
Is there any model or brand I'm missing in this list?
Which is your best choice? I'm looking for a vesatile trombone, clear and deep sound, able to play jazz, musical theatre, pop recordings...

Thanks!!

M&W 336

Rath R3F

Edwards T327

Shires 0.525

Schagerl James Morrisson

Kühnl & Hoyer .527

Bach 36B

Conn 88H with SL2525 slide
Conn 79H
Conn 50H

Yamaha YSL640

King 3B/F+
King 607F
King 608F

Courtois AC260BO

Benge 175F

Holton TR-165

Bach Omega (TB-200F)
Yamaha YSL 446 (646)
Yamaha YSL 684
Reynolds

Note that current King 3B Plus (3BPL) is not available with F. You need the older 2125F

There is a Benge "closed wrap" with F (165? 160?)

The Yamaha 356 works really great.

“I'm looking for a vesatile trombone, clear and deep sound, able to play jazz, musical theatre, pop recordings... ”

Practice.

I've owned a 36B, ysl683, ysl684 and ysl640 over the years. The ysl640 with a 5G Megatone was my favorite of the bunch. Very flexible combo for me. It was the horn I reached for most often for years.

Bach5G wrote: ↑Sun Feb 23, 2020 9:52 am “I'm looking for a vesatile trombone, clear and deep sound, able to play jazz, musical theatre, pop recordings... ”

Practice.

Which is your best choice? I'm looking for a vesatile trombone, clear and deep sound, able to play jazz, musical theatre, pop recordings...

You might want to add the YSL645/646 (depending on if you want an F attachment). They're the older version of the 630/640. All of them play relatively similarly. Also as others mentioned, the 356/446. They all play a little different but are fairly similar. The 630,640,645, and 646 all have an 8.5" bell on a 525 slide. The 446 and 356 both have as far as I'm aware based on the part catalogue, the same bell (8" yellow or red depending on the specific model). The 446 has a 525 slide but the 356 has a 500/525 slide, which I actually really like. I'm in the process of putting a 646 bell on my 356 slide actually. The 64* bells are pretty light... the 446/356 bells are a little on the heavier side.

The Shires and Edwards stuff (probably Rath and M&W too? I don't remember off the top of my head) is actually a large tenor bell section but with a 525 slide. So they do tend to be a little "deeper" or whatever term you want to use to ascribe that. That also means that you can pop a 547 slide on it if you want. Shires (and possibly others) also offers a 508/525 option. Depending on how much bread you want to sink into it is a little brighter and balances out the larger bell section. The Shires 525 slide also offer leadpipes for both large and small shank mouthpiece receivers, which makes a surprisingly big difference. Very, very versatile.

Don't get too caught up in brands, labels or strangers opinions. Just about any horn you pick up can be played convincingly in any style.

Don't write off 508 bores. A 3b could do any of that. You just have to try horns.

I've owned a lot of "medium bores". The Shires sounds/plays/feels so much like a large bore that I wouldn't bother. Also, to me, anything with an 8.5" bell retains a lot of the 547 feel. In my opinion, if you're going to go 525, you should also go 8". The characteristic medium bore benefits also come from the smaller shank, so keep the large shank leadpipe as an option, but not the main pipe.

My personal favorite 525 was M&W (never played one with a valve) . Then Rath R3, 79h, 175f, 88h w/525, and maybe 3b+ or 3bSS, and 36b. Shires just played like a big heavy horn to me.

Oh, and there's a Lawler big boy for sale on the forum right now which I've never played.

Nobody can answer this for you, you just have to play horns for yourself to see what fits your style.

And obviously practice.

previously owned a 36b, 78H, and a shires .525. The Rath R3F Rotax I recently got is not only the best medium trombone I've ever played but one of my favorite trombones of any type I've ever owned.

Since you didn't list classical a 3B+ will suit your needs.

Since you want an F rotor horn a Bach 36 should be easy to find.

Conn 78H/79H are great just hard to find (79H being the trigger horn).

If it's in the budget, the Rath R3F is fantastic. I have had one for a few years now. Actually, I bought it with an R3 slide and R4 bell, then found an R3 bell used. With the larger bell and large shank lead pipe, no one can tell it's not a a 547 horn. With the 8" bell and small shank lead pipe, it is very versatile. I have used it in concert band, rock bands and many pit shows.

If $4k is not in the budget, a good used Bach 36B is a great horn as well and can be had for $1,500.

Williams 8/9 if you can find one.

Thrawn22 wrote: ↑Sun Feb 23, 2020 11:26 am Conn 78H/79H are great just hard to find (79H being the trigger horn).

There's a 79h for sale in the classifieds.

Since you mentioned K&H...

Kuhnl & Hoyer BVL .513 Bb/F gold brass bell/nickel silver LW slide.

I owned the straight version, and years later I still have seller's remorse. One of the very best medium bore horns I have ever owned or played.

In my opinion,
A Good used Bach 36B would be at the top of my list
If you can find one, a Conn 79H would be excellent
Any of the Yamaha Medium bores
The King 3B+F , again rarer but a good solid horn
The EDWARDS/Shires/M&K/Rath/etc.. are all good horns but you`ll spend a fortune on it

dukesboneman wrote: ↑Tue Feb 25, 2020 8:47 am In my opinion,


The EDWARDS/Shires/M&K/Rath/etc.. are all good horns but you`ll spend a fortune on it

Agreed on your list, but...

Have you looked at flute prices lately? How about fiddles? Spending a fortune is relative...I just picked up a rare bird Shires from Noah@BrassArk (Thanks again, Noah! I'm loving that horn) and my wife (who just bought a new Haynes handmade flute) said, "I wish I could buy my flute for that much."

Dennis wrote: ↑Tue Feb 25, 2020 1:05 pm

dukesboneman wrote: ↑Tue Feb 25, 2020 8:47 am In my opinion,


The EDWARDS/Shires/M&K/Rath/etc.. are all good horns but you`ll spend a fortune on it

Agreed on your list, but...

Have you looked at flute prices lately? How about fiddles? Spending a fortune is relative...I just picked up a rare bird Shires from Noah@BrassArk (Thanks again, Noah! I'm loving that horn) and my wife (who just bought a new Haynes handmade flute) said, "I wish I could buy my flute for that much."

Yeah, that's totally right. My girlfriend is flutist too, and the prices of flutes, piccolos... are way above the prices of the more expensive trombones... Not to mention bassoons for example...

4k for a trombones is a lot of money but really not that much, and is true that surely you can find a bone for 1.500-2.000 that can do the job pretty pretty good too.

Ditto for earlier comments on Shires..... I have one w/ a .508 bore and 8in bell. Definitely plays a lot larger than a “small bore.” Would say it’s similar to a medium bore; like a Bach 36, etc.

J

That's quite a variation in horns and prices in the original poster's list.

My first pro horn was a mid 80's 36B that I purchased new in 1987 and eventually sold when I took a break from playing.

When I got back into playing I ended up on a 79H and eventually had a Rotax valve installed. This is my current horn and is a keeper.

If the Yamaha .525s are anything like the Xeno line then they are worth considering.

If money was no object, I'd pick a R3F with the Rotax valve. I played one with the 8" Nickel bell, red turning slide, and yellow brass slide at ITF2018 that was incredible.

Trav1s wrote: ↑Wed Feb 26, 2020 5:11 am If the Yamaha .525s are anything like the Xeno line then they are worth considering.

Actually, in my opinion, they're quite different. Well, at least compared to the classical Xenos. But they are somewhat similar to the small bore Xenos which are more flexible timbrally. I think it makes sense to think of them as a bigger version of the small bores rather than a small version of the large bores. On paper, it might not seem that way with the 8.5" bell but the 645/646 series at least are pretty lightweight; certainly lighterweight than the 400 series bells. And whatever pipe they have in them is quite well balanced with the rest of the setup.

alberttrombone wrote: ↑Sun Feb 23, 2020 8:54 am Hello everyone,

I'm looking to buy a good medium bore trombone with f attachment.
Is there any model or brand I'm missing in this list?
Which is your best choice? I'm looking for a vesatile trombone, clear and deep sound, able to play jazz, musical theatre, pop recordings...

Thanks!!

M&W 336

Rath R3F

Edwards T327

Shires 0.525

Schagerl James Morrisson

Kühnl & Hoyer .527

Bach 36B

Conn 88H with SL2525 slide
Conn 79H
Conn 50H

Yamaha YSL640

King 3B/F+
King 607F
King 608F

Courtois AC260BO

Benge 175F

Holton TR-165

As for the clear and deep sound and all of the other characteristics you stated that's up to YOU! If you're rich but them all and try them all and see which ones YOU get a clear an deep sound on. I'm not trying to be snarky but I see these posts all of the time. Most of what I play on others will not and vice versa. Go to a convention-I believe there are a few left that will showcase more instruments than you could ever dream of. Then you'll have your answer. Good luck.

Getzen 725 has f attachment and a dual bore slide 525/547. It is an intermediate model but it plays awesome for the price and it is very versable - I played 1st trombone with bach 12c mouthpiece in a college jazz band and had some experience with 6 1/2 mouthpiece with some classical music

Of all the instruments that I have owned over the past 40+ years... the Rath R3F with Rotax valve is BY FAR my favorite instrument.

How about Conn 52H-anybody using that?

Markinsky wrote: ↑Mon Feb 12, 2024 8:47 am How about Conn 52H-anybody using that?

If only you had waited a couple more weeks you would have gotten the 4 year old dead thread bump award
EZ