TromboneChat

tbdana wrote: Mon Jun 16, 2025 10:07 am I hear pedants constantly repeating by rote how evil it is and what a horrible player you must be, with poor morals and a penchant for uncontrolled drooling, should you ever stop a note with the tongue.

Going back through the increasingly dense mists of time ... I seem to recall that the prohibition on tongue stopping (at least when I was playing the saxophone) was largely on the grounds that it was a bad habit because it would inhibit your speed in fast passages -- like using a finger to index 3rd position on a trombone. Drooling could be good -- it keeps the reed moist and flexible.

I a simple fact that you cannot get the same crisp ending to a note without using the tongue.

I think there's room for some dispute here, depending on what "crisp" may be taken to mean, but it gets esoteric.

I liken the rule of not stopping notes with the tongue to the rule in English about always avoiding alliteration. It's a fine rule, until you grow enough to learn when breaking it is proper and effective.
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If we took all the alliteration out of English, we'd lose a lot of poetry. On the other hand, listening to a highly alliterated scientific talk, business presentation, or court argument is probably not something you want to do more than once -- at least outside of a comedy club. Context matters.

ghmerrill wrote: Mon Jun 16, 2025 10:24 am [Drooling could be good -- it keeps the reed moist and flexible.

If we took all the alliteration out of English, we'd lose a lot of poetry. On the other hand, listening to a highly alliterated scientific talk, business presentation, or court argument is probably not something you want to do more than once -- at least outside of a comedy club. Context matters.

Exactly. Thanks.

ghmerrill wrote: Mon Jun 16, 2025 10:24 am I seem to recall that the prohibition on tongue stopping (at least when I was playing the saxophone) was largely on the grounds that it was a bad habit because it would inhibit your speed in fast passages -- like using a finger to index 3rd position on a trombone.

There is truth to that (not the finger thing, the tongue thing) and individuals with heavy tongues often have trouble with fast stuff. It's the classic "the entire band drags on the shout chorus" thing - we do, and this is probably why.

On "Taste of Honey", you can hear Herb Alpert using tongue stops during the phrase and an air stop at the end of the phrase. Different flavors, for sure.