Vintage Conn Bass Trombones - pictures, specifications, characteristics. Who played them?

HawaiiTromboneGuy · Post by **HawaiiTromboneGuy** » Fri Nov 06, 2020 11:43 pm

mrdeacon wrote: Fri Nov 06, 2020 10:28 pm That triangle mechanism on the new horn is super neat!

So what's the difference between the bell throats on all three of these? The middle one is the Fuchs right?

It is indeed pretty neat!

And correct, the one in the middle is the Fuchs. The Fuchs is definitely the biggest of the three. The one to the right is very similar. The newest one on the left is the smallest of the bunch and is more like the small throat 70H.

Burgerbob wrote: Fri Nov 06, 2020 10:42 pm I'll point out that this same mechanism is on the early 20th century Kruspe that swisstbone has up in another thread. Very interesting.

Oh, also I love the little tiny guard on the F attachment tuning slide. Never seen that before!!

Good observation! I just took a look at his photos and it definitely is the same mechanism on his Kruspe.

That tiny guard on the F tuning slide is definitely cool. I haven’t seen one like it before as well, but I’m sure the Conn experts will know more.

SwissTbone · Post by **SwissTbone** » Sat Nov 07, 2020 3:50 am

Hm? Triangle mechanism? On the valve? Sorry, I don't understand.

Post by **BGuttman** » Sat Nov 07, 2020 9:44 am

SwissTbone wrote: Sat Nov 07, 2020 3:50 am Hm? Triangle mechanism? On the valve? Sorry, I don't understand.

The strap on the thong pulls on a triangular (approximately) shaped mechanism to turn the valve.

Kbiggs · Post by **Kbiggs** » Sat Nov 07, 2020 10:23 am

What a gorgeous collection!

SwissTbone · Post by **SwissTbone** » Sat Nov 07, 2020 12:03 pm

BGuttman wrote: Sat Nov 07, 2020 9:44 am
SwissTbone wrote: Sat Nov 07, 2020 3:50 am Hm? Triangle mechanism? On the valve? Sorry, I don't understand.
The strap on the thong pulls on a triangular (approximately) shaped mechanism to turn the valve.

Ah ok. Thanks.

FOSSIL · Post by **FOSSIL** » Fri Nov 20, 2020 8:26 am

Just built a slot in second valve for my 60H. Conn valve and tube except for the mid-size bend.

Chris

FOSSIL · Post by **FOSSIL** » Fri Nov 20, 2020 8:28 am

Another angle...

SwissTbone · Post by **SwissTbone** » Fri Nov 20, 2020 10:33 am

Yeah! That's cool!

elmsandr · Post by **elmsandr** » Fri Nov 20, 2020 11:55 am

Long lever AND string linkage?

Ridiculous, and oh so beautiful.

Cheers,
Andy

Kbiggs · Post by **Kbiggs** » Fri Nov 20, 2020 12:57 pm

Wild! Interesting thumb touch—plate arrangement. E or E-flat?

FOSSIL · Post by **FOSSIL** » Fri Nov 20, 2020 1:07 pm

elmsandr wrote: Fri Nov 20, 2020 11:55 am Long lever AND string linkage?

Ridiculous, and oh so beautiful.

Cheers,
Andy

Ha ha ! Second string linkage slot in I've built.....miniball at the other end keeps it online..... with string on the F valve, you pretty much have to have string on the second due to the very short throw with string. Nice and silent. The connecting rod is hollow, so light.

Chris

FOSSIL · Post by **FOSSIL** » Fri Nov 20, 2020 1:12 pm

Kbiggs wrote: Fri Nov 20, 2020 12:57 pm Wild! Interesting thumb touch—plate arrangement. E or E-flat?

Touch plate is like the Holton slot in mechanism. Not perfect, but this is for occasional use and to be honest, it's better than I expected. It's Eb....I could add D tube easily.

Chris

Savio · Post by **Savio** » Fri Nov 20, 2020 1:38 pm

Thats nice Chris! You make it your self? I put a weight on my 60h. Just to make it more balanced in my hands. Here is a picture. Its not nice but after some time with this solution I also feel to make it permanent.

https://1drv.ms/u/s!AnFhNyFesmcYhfxJG3R ... w?e=6t7xWZ

Leif

FOSSIL · Post by **FOSSIL** » Fri Nov 20, 2020 4:42 pm

Savio wrote: Fri Nov 20, 2020 1:38 pm Thats nice Chris! You make it your self? I put a weight on my 60h. Just to make it more balanced in my hands. Here is a picture. Its not nice but after some time with this solution I also feel to make it permanent.

https://1drv.ms/u/s!AnFhNyFesmcYhfxJG3R ... w?e=6t7xWZ

Leif

Yes Leif, I built it myself...no way could I afford all the custom stuff I have if I didn't do my own work. That was around 10 hours, but it doesn't have a final finish yet, but then nor does the 60H..... they may just stay like that. A balance weight on a 60H is a good idea.....I have one on the plain F tuning slide myself.

Chris

Tbarh · Post by **Tbarh** » Sun Nov 22, 2020 3:32 am

FOSSIL wrote: Fri Nov 20, 2020 8:28 am Another angle...

In my opinion, a trombone should be really back heavy, and also the valve tubing layout should leave more weight on the neckpipe side of the bell... In this respect this horn should be a dream to play ergonomically.. And a 60H at that...

FOSSIL · Post by **FOSSIL** » Sun Nov 22, 2020 4:10 am

Tbarh wrote: Sun Nov 22, 2020 3:32 am
FOSSIL wrote: Fri Nov 20, 2020 8:28 am Another angle...
In my opinion, a trombone should be really back heavy, and also the valve tubing layout should leave more weight on the neckpipe side of the bell... In this respect this horn should be a dream to play ergonomically.. And a 60H at that...

You are so right, it's a dream ergonomically....though there are times when the ease of use of the independent will displace it... but that may be rare indeed. I made one for a 71H that I had and totally loved it, but one of my students needed it for his 60H, so I sold it to him. Always regretted that, so now I have an open wrap slot in !!
There are a few interesting changes that the valve has created.... it still feels like a single, not a double, and the F valve blows better with this added valve in place. No negatives so far and about 50 grams heavier than the plain tuning slide that has a Conn balance weight added, So feel in the hand is not too different.
Can't wait to get back to work with it....three weeks to go until some recordings...bring it on !

Chris

WGWTR180 · Post by **WGWTR180** » Sun Nov 22, 2020 6:28 am

Chris. Blown away with this. If I lived closer(HAHA), had a 60H(HAHA), I'd pay you to do this!!!

FOSSIL · Post by **FOSSIL** » Sun Nov 22, 2020 7:18 am

WGWTR180 wrote: Sun Nov 22, 2020 6:28 am Chris. Blown away with this. If I lived closer(HAHA), had a 60H(HAHA), I'd pay you to do this!!!

If you lived closer, I probably wouldn't have any work at all !!

. It's funny how the Holton slot-in changes the 169 in a big, fundamental kind of way.... people either hated it (Ray Premru) or loved it (Dave Taylor) but the Holton slot ins either stayed in or were never used. This valve seems to be less intrusive.
As for building for other people, that takes a lot of fun out of it.... this was just an experiment and if it was a failure it would not matter a jot. I could walk away. Once I commit to a job for someone, pressure comes into the equation...and deciding what to charge.... the need to be fair and still not make a loss. That adds up to stress.
Any jobs I choose with great care....friends and students for the most part. Now, if you lived closer Bill, you would definitely be on my approved list !

.

Chris

sf105 · Post by **sf105** » Sun Nov 22, 2020 10:05 am

Savio wrote: Fri Nov 20, 2020 1:38 pm Thats nice Chris! You make it your self? I put a weight on my 60h. Just to make it more balanced in my hands. Here is a picture. Its not nice but after some time with this solution I also feel to make it permanent.

https://1drv.ms/u/s!AnFhNyFesmcYhfxJG3R ... w?e=6t7xWZ

Leif

I have a couple of horns that are very front heavy. I went for the spare mouthpiece and electrical tape solution. Ugly but effective.

S

FOSSIL · Post by **FOSSIL** » Sun Nov 22, 2020 11:52 am

Electrical tape....useful if you want to make a bright sound....

.

Chris

FOSSIL · Post by **FOSSIL** » Sun Nov 22, 2020 11:55 am

Here you go....balance weight on F tuning slide...

Chris

WGWTR180 · Post by **WGWTR180** » Sun Nov 22, 2020 5:03 pm

FOSSIL wrote: Sun Nov 22, 2020 7:18 am
WGWTR180 wrote: Sun Nov 22, 2020 6:28 am Chris. Blown away with this. If I lived closer(HAHA), had a 60H(HAHA), I'd pay you to do this!!!
If you lived closer, I probably wouldn't have any work at all !! . It's funny how the Holton slot-in changes the 169 in a big, fundamental kind of way.... people either hated it (Ray Premru) or loved it (Dave Taylor) but the Holton slot ins either stayed in or were never used. This valve seems to be less intrusive.
As for building for other people, that takes a lot of fun out of it.... this was just an experiment and if it was a failure it would not matter a jot. I could walk away. Once I commit to a job for someone, pressure comes into the equation...and deciding what to charge.... the need to be fair and still not make a loss. That adds up to stress.
Any jobs I choose with great care....friends and students for the most part. Now, if you lived closer Bill, you would definitely be on my approved list ! .

Chris

Wouldn't want to cause any pressure. I'm thinking playing, crash course in soldering, and beer drinking. Rinse and repeat.

GabrielRice · Post by **GabrielRice** » Mon Nov 23, 2020 6:59 am

WGWTR180 wrote: Sun Nov 22, 2020 5:03 pm Wouldn't want to cause any pressure. I'm thinking playing, crash course in soldering, and beer drinking. Rinse and repeat.

That sounds like huge fun. Can I come?

WGWTR180 · Post by **WGWTR180** » Mon Nov 23, 2020 8:02 am

GabrielRice wrote: Mon Nov 23, 2020 6:59 am
WGWTR180 wrote: Sun Nov 22, 2020 5:03 pm Wouldn't want to cause any pressure. I'm thinking playing, crash course in soldering, and beer drinking. Rinse and repeat.
That sounds like huge fun. Can I come?

Oh Yeh!!!!!!!!

mlshermancpa · Post by **mlshermancpa** » Fri Dec 04, 2020 7:06 pm

Bloo wrote: Sun Jul 14, 2019 7:49 pm Played a 110H from the 60s with a custom Hagmann valve. It was loaned from a professor at my local uni. I played bass in a community brass choir for a year. It blended easily and was loud enough to only be one of two basses.
I also used it to play a few performances with my brass quintet. We performed before the choir a few times, and travel arrangements meant I was unable to take my tenor. With a tenor mouthpiece, the 110h still sounded wonderful and did the job. Not as well as a tenor, but as well as a bass could.

The 110h suited any style I wanted to use it for, and even stepped outside of the role and filled a tenor role on occasion. It was a dream to play. The only thing I don't like is how large the bell is. Would much prefer a 9 - 8.5 inch bell over the 10" monster I played.

Overall?
I really want one and I ache every time I play my current bass.

How do you think the 110H holds up (sound wise) against the older vintage Conn models? I have a 110H but haven't played many other horns for comparison purposes. Just started doubling a few years ago.

imsevimse · Post by **imsevimse** » Sat Dec 05, 2020 5:34 am

mlshermancpa wrote: Fri Dec 04, 2020 7:06 pm
Bloo wrote: Sun Jul 14, 2019 7:49 pm Played a 110H from the 60s with a custom Hagmann valve. It was loaned from a professor at my local uni. I played bass in a community brass choir for a year. It blended easily and was loud enough to only be one of two basses.
I also used it to play a few performances with my brass quintet. We performed before the choir a few times, and travel arrangements meant I was unable to take my tenor. With a tenor mouthpiece, the 110h still sounded wonderful and did the job. Not as well as a tenor, but as well as a bass could.

The 110h suited any style I wanted to use it for, and even stepped outside of the role and filled a tenor role on occasion. It was a dream to play. The only thing I don't like is how large the bell is. Would much prefer a 9 - 8.5 inch bell over the 10" monster I played.

Overall?
I really want one and I ache every time I play my current bass.
How do you think the 110H holds up (sound wise) against the older vintage Conn models? I have a 110H but haven't played many other horns for comparison purposes. Just started doubling a few years ago.

Interesting to hear about the 110h as well as the 112h compared to the older ones. We do not hear as much about them as the earlier models. Personally I have never played one and never met any basstrombonist with either one over here. I'm Interested to learn more about this too.

/Tom

FOSSIL · Post by **FOSSIL** » Sat Dec 05, 2020 8:02 am

Here's my double set up for Bb/F/bE/C....not as funcky as my previous set up, but it blows better.

Chris

FOSSIL · Post by **FOSSIL** » Mon Dec 07, 2020 12:24 pm

Remember that slot in that I built a few weeks ago ? Well, I'm back to work tomorrow and am taking it in.... except that when I tried to put it in my carbon fiber case, it didn't fit....fact it was not going in any of my cases...even my leather gig bag was not happy taking this bell.....finally, I tried an Eastman....it fits !!!! This is the big bass case and not really my fav, but it is the most accommodating of all my boxes and has saved the day. A good case if you have an odd shaped trombone....thought I'd share that info.

Chris

FOSSIL · Post by **FOSSIL** » Mon Dec 07, 2020 12:25 pm

JohnL · Post by **JohnL** » Mon Dec 07, 2020 1:05 pm

FOSSIL wrote: Mon Dec 07, 2020 12:24 pmWell, I'm back to work tomorrow...

FOSSIL · Post by **FOSSIL** » Mon Dec 07, 2020 1:39 pm

JohnL wrote: Mon Dec 07, 2020 1:05 pm
FOSSIL wrote: Mon Dec 07, 2020 12:24 pmWell, I'm back to work tomorrow...

Thanks....gonna feel odd

Chris

FOSSIL · Post by **FOSSIL** » Fri Dec 11, 2020 3:40 pm

Well, especially for WGW I have reworked my slot in valve so that the valve is not offset.... one for you Bill !!!

mrdeacon · Post by **mrdeacon** » Sat Dec 12, 2020 12:27 am

Chris is that a certain 2g I spot in the 60h?

FOSSIL · Post by **FOSSIL** » Sat Dec 12, 2020 4:11 am

mrdeacon wrote: Sat Dec 12, 2020 12:27 am Chris is that a certain 2g I spot in the 60h?

At times it's an uncertain 2G...but yes, your old 2G. Working really well in the orchestra....as is your old 60H.

Chris

WGWTR180 · Post by **WGWTR180** » Sat Dec 12, 2020 11:37 am

FOSSIL wrote: Fri Dec 11, 2020 3:40 pm Well, especially for WGW I have reworked my slot in valve so that the valve is not offset.... one for you Bill !!!

Thank you!!!

FOSSIL · Post by **FOSSIL** » Sat Dec 12, 2020 12:49 pm

Well Bill, that was what I originally planned, but I decided to put tube either side of the main horn, which meant that the valve twisted.... I thought about what you said and decided to change it. I was able to lose the long brace that was needed before and was not in a good place and so the valve now blows twice as well !!
Thanks Bill !!

Chris

Tbarh · Post by **Tbarh** » Sat Dec 12, 2020 6:16 pm

mrdeacon wrote: Sat Dec 12, 2020 12:27 am Chris is that a certain 2g I spot in the 60h?

Is this the "certain" 2G that are used as a Model for a newer certain english made copy?

FOSSIL · Post by **FOSSIL** » Sat Dec 12, 2020 7:00 pm

Tbarh wrote: Sat Dec 12, 2020 6:16 pm
mrdeacon wrote: Sat Dec 12, 2020 12:27 am Chris is that a certain 2g I spot in the 60h?
Is this the "certain" 2G that are used as a Model for a newer certain english made copy?

Nope... that was his other one.

Chris

WGWTR180 · Post by **WGWTR180** » Sun Dec 13, 2020 6:40 am

FOSSIL wrote: Sat Dec 12, 2020 12:49 pm Well Bill, that was what I originally planned, but I decided to put tube either side of the main horn, which meant that the valve twisted.... I thought about what you said and decided to change it. I was able to lose the long brace that was needed before and was not in a good place and so the valve now blows twice as well !!
Thanks Bill !!

Chris

It really is great that you can do this work yourself! Or a curse depending on how one looks at it. Either way you have a wonderful instrument that works for you.

FOSSIL · Post by **FOSSIL** » Sun Dec 13, 2020 7:33 am

Yes Bill, it can be a curse...but very rarely. Just doing it for myself is a relaxation....and you learn. I suspected that the brace on the old design was a bad thing but it had to be there and it had to be where it was. Get rid of it and I have a different valve...much more free and centered.
When mrdeacon sold me the 60H he was very honest and said it was a bad horn....and it was ! I thought I might be able to save it, and here we are a few months on with a great horn. A lot has changed but all the original metal is still there, excepting the leadpipe which is now a 70H pipe.

Chris

JackSchatz · Post by **JackSchatz** » Mon Dec 14, 2020 1:50 pm

I wanted to respond to the question of what Erwin Price was playing. Erwin was my first trombone teacher. Marvelous player. The horn Erwin was playing in the above pictures was a Conn 80H. .522 bore tuning in the slide. The 80H was also made with a flat wrap like the 14H but unlike the 14H which was a duo bore slide , the 80H had a straight bore of .522.

imsevimse · Post by **imsevimse** » Thu Dec 17, 2020 2:14 pm

JackSchatz wrote: Mon Dec 14, 2020 1:50 pm I wanted to respond to the question of what Erwin Price was playing. Erwin was my first trombone teacher. Marvelous player. The horn Erwin was playing in the above pictures was a Conn 80H. .522 bore tuning in the slide. The 80H was also made with a flat wrap like the 14H but unlike the 14H which was a duo bore slide , the 80H had a straight bore of .522.

Thanks

/Tom

Post by **blast** » Mon Jun 13, 2022 9:38 am

Old topic but I wanted to share a new project....

Post by **blast** » Mon Jun 13, 2022 9:39 am

I call it the 'opera wrap'

Post by **blast** » Mon Jun 13, 2022 9:41 am

Works in small spaces as it doesn't stick out the back and has a small slide to easily empty water.

Post by **blast** » Mon Jun 13, 2022 9:43 am

Will also have Eb extention tubes....

elmsandr · Post by **elmsandr** » Mon Jun 13, 2022 11:03 am

Perfect. Filing this away for when I make my next valve section. I do so hate the wraps sticking out the back.

Cheers,
Andy

Posaunus · Post by **Posaunus** » Mon Jun 13, 2022 11:15 am

blast wrote: Mon Jun 13, 2022 9:41 am Works in small spaces as it doesn't stick out the back and has a small slide to easily empty water.

Brilliant!

goldendomer04 · Post by **goldendomer04** » Thu Jun 16, 2022 7:58 pm

I just wanted to share my new toy from Noah Gladstone. This had been his personal bass and was previously owned by Jeff Reynolds.

Jeff Reynolds had the horn modified by Minick and Noah had Robb Stewart add the tuning wheel.

75898C24-5E28-4FED-AFD0-F79FE2BF8650.jpeg

5FE8CABD-6F76-46F2-A9AE-34FC85157FBA.jpeg

71637AB9-873F-4D43-8D47-3B806EF8C504.jpeg

9C850306-A388-46B4-99AC-5B6487905070.jpeg

HawaiiTromboneGuy · Post by **HawaiiTromboneGuy** » Wed Dec 07, 2022 12:05 am

Thought I would also add to this thread. Was fortunate enough to purchase German’s 62H that he had listed here on the forum. The horn is absolutely gorgeous and is completely stock/original.

I was also fortunate enough to purchase this 1935 70H SPEC from J Landress during their Black Friday sale.

Unfortunately though I did have my three wisdom teeth pulled out this past Wednesday. Tomorrow marks a full week since and my gums are still healing. At least I have something to look forward to once I’m all healed up!