Modern Greenhoe Bass Trombones-What’s your take?

[Jbeckett]

I have a student looking to purchase a GB5-gold brass independent bass.
I haven’t played one. Curious as to thoughts from those who have.

Thanks
Jeff

[Burgerbob]

I'm a bach guy, but the GC model basses have typically played and sounded better to me. The GBs have been too woof.

[Jbeckett]

Both soldered bells?

[Burgerbob]

Couldn't tell you- just the random horns I've played at shows.

If it were me, I'd probably get a GB5 and put on a 50 bell... might solved some of those issues.

[Jbeckett]

The GC is unsoldered.

[Finetales]

I was very impressed with the whole Greenhoe lineup I tried at this year's NAMM and last year's ITF. In both cases I thought they were among the best-playing instruments in the show. I generally prefer Conn-style large tenors and basses to Bach, so it's not surprising to me that I preferred the GC series, but the GB horns I tried were excellent as well. If I was looking to spend that much money on a new horn, Greenhoe would be one of maybe 3 or 4 makers on the shortlist.

[Jbeckett]

I appreciate that. He’s shopping now but played one and loved it. So, naturally, I’m trying to help make sure.

[bassbone1993]

Couldn't tell you- just the random horns I've played at shows.

If it were me, I'd probably get a GB5 and put on a 50 bell... might solved some of those issues.

I’d be curious how the O’Malley ny50 bell would sound on it.

[Burgerbob]

See, that's something I would do!!

[Jbeckett]

Yamabach
Greenhoebach
I might too, if it was for me.

[GabrielRice]

I had GB5 with a gold brass bell. It was built impeccably and played very well...until I got it into an orchestra and couldn't hear or feel the core of the sound at all. I switched the bell and handslide for Bach parts and played it that way for a while, but honestly I was still fighting with it and replaced it with a Stephens bass trombone.

Speaking ONLY for myself, the oversized tubing in the bell section of Greenhoe at the small leg of the tuning slide - and of Edwards at both sides of the tuning slide - is a no-go. It clearly works for many players, but I learned to play on a Bach and then spent many years on a Shires. Making the instrument that big at that point in the taper forces me to work too hard for the center of the pitch and core of the sound, and then I miss easy notes and feel like I should consider retiring.

[Jbeckett]

That’s interesting.

[Jbeckett]

I probably need to clarify on my last comment.
What I mean is it’s interesting how we differ as players and what we pay attention to.
I have two different Edwards bass set ups, that are completely different, but the only difference is a thin brace tuning slide and a single vs dual bore slide.
Same pipe, same bell, same axials.
It’s odd how everything is different but can be made to sound the same, even if it’s by someone else.

[RJMason]

Schilke has a pretty strong warranty. I was a Greenhoe artist for a time and found their customer service responsive in that they’ll work with you on repairs and replacements. That said, I experienced some durability issues with frequent professional use that ultimately led me to move on. It came down to not being able to afford the downtime of sending instruments out for service.

[Jbeckett]

Schilke has a pretty strong warranty. I was a Greenhoe artist for a time and found their customer service responsive in that they’ll work with you on repairs and replacements. That said, I experienced some durability issues with frequent professional use that ultimately led me to move on. It came down to not being able to afford the downtime of sending instruments out for service.

Also very interesting.

[WGWTR180]

Schilke has a pretty strong warranty. I was a Greenhoe artist for a time and found their customer service responsive in that they’ll work with you on repairs and replacements. That said, I experienced some durability issues with frequent professional use that ultimately led me to move on. It came down to not being able to afford the downtime of sending instruments out for service.
[/quote


Care to elaborate on "durability issues"?

[MStarke]

I love my original Greenhoe, Conn-style, dependent, tuning-in-slide, basically the "Reichenbach model".
Relatively easy to play, the easiest fit for bigband, but also great for other settings.
Some people that tried it found the middle register needed a bit getting used to, for me it works just fine.
I must say, this is probably the trombone that I handle with the most care, as I am sort of afraid of finding someone to repair it with the appropriate skill.

[baBposaune]

I own and use an original Greenhoe GC5 dependent. This is a pre-Schilke build and plays like a Conn 62H on steroids. My primary use for this instrument is for orchestra although I have used it in a large brass ensemble and big band. I keep going back to my Shires horns for the latter two ensembles even though the Greenhoe is versatile. I get the same broad sound with the Greenhoe with less effort than my dual bore slide on a Shires. Been a Conn player for decades but have owned and enjoyed Bach and Getzen basses, too. In some ways I think the Greehoe is a superior playing horn to the 62H. The one I use was first owned by John Engelkes and I have already had an LA player make me promise to sell it to him if I ever decide to part with it.

[CalgaryTbone]

I'm not a Bass player, but the Schilke Greenhoes were some of my favorite instruments that I tried at the ITF's in Salt Lake and London, ON recently. I actually had a hard time even deciding which horn I liked best of the set. Yellow, gold and red brass bells were all good, but just slightly different. The red brass slide-tuning tenor was really fun to play too. I think they have a good product, and the horns felt good in my hands. The folks that ran the display did a good job of having all the slides and tuning slides working well, something that some of the other vendors should take note of. I liked the small bores too! I didn't get around to trying any basses last time, though.

Jim Scott

[Jbeckett]

All helpful stuff.

[Schultz]

I love my original Greenhoe, Conn-style, dependent, tuning-in-slide, basically the "Reichenbach model".
Relatively easy to play, the easiest fit for bigband, but also great for other settings.
Some people that tried it found the middle register needed a bit getting used to, for me it works just fine.
I must say, this is probably the trombone that I handle with the most care, as I am sort of afraid of finding someone to repair it with the appropriate skill.

I also have an original GH custom basically the same as yours but with independent valves. I’ve taken it to Lätzsch twice for servicing and always been very happy!

[Jbeckett]

I’ll put this in there.
When Gary first got out of building horns, I tried out three different models at Baltimore brass, that were Schilke/Greenhoe, and they didn’t hold a candle to the shires I had at the time. That Shires is long gone though.
I’d like to get my hands on a dual bore Bach style independent original Greenhoe.
But, this one’s for student.
Just to compare. And surprise my wife. She loves when I buy horns.

[MStarke]

I also have an original GH custom basically the same as yours but with independent valves. I’ve taken it to Lätzsch twice for servicing and always been very happy!

Yes, Lätzsch (or Kromat) would be my choice. And I am still waiting to meet you randomly at some gig here in Hamburg!

[Bach50b3]

I have an OG Greenhoe-Bach 50 from 2004. It's an amazing horn that I still have not found a horn that I like more.

That said, if one does come up, I would switch.... but after 22 years... why?

(That said, O'Malley and M&W are always calling my name...)

[Jbeckett]

He bought one (GB53G?), and I played it. Felt cheap. It was a modern one and I’m sure the valves are great, but, he sent it back.
Back on his shires Q with rotax.

[WGWTR180]

I have an OG Greenhoe-Bach 50 from 2004. It's an amazing horn that I still have not found a horn that I like more.

That said, if one does come up, I would switch.... but after 22 years... why?

(That said, O'Malley and M&W are always calling my name...)

The Greenhoe instruments from that period are different, and in my opinion, better than the ones built today. I've been lead to believe by someone who played a new one for awhile that the lead pipes in the newer ones could be the issue.

[bassbone1993]

I have an OG Greenhoe-Bach 50 from 2004. It's an amazing horn that I still have not found a horn that I like more.

That said, if one does come up, I would switch.... but after 22 years... why?

(That said, O'Malley and M&W are always calling my name...)

The Greenhoe instruments from that period are different, and in my opinion, better than the ones built today. I've been lead to believe by someone who played a new one for awhile that the lead pipes in the newer ones could be the issue.

I’ve heard of a few players who never use the stock leadpipes, or request a number of them to try out and pick the best ones

[WGWTR180]

The Greenhoe instruments from that period are different, and in my opinion, better than the ones built today. I've been lead to believe by someone who played a new one for awhile that the lead pipes in the newer ones could be the issue.

I’ve heard of a few players who never use the stock leadpipes, or request a number of them to try out and pick the best ones

Same here. I would wonder why the pipes are so inconsistently made that one would need to order multiples.

[WGWTR180]

I'm a bach guy, but the GC model basses have typically played and sounded better to me. The GBs have been too woof.

I agree with you on this. They just seem to resonate better. Here's a true story that took place more than a few years back. Famous Bass trombonist who had a major job went to Greenhoe with colleagues to try out instruments. After spending time playing multiple offerings he settle on one intstrument. Evidentially he did not want to know what he was trying(maybe the bells were unmarked? I don't know). He loved it-colleagues loved it. Once he was told he had chosen the Conn style instrument he said nope can't play a Conn. Has to be a Bach. I think he took a Bach like instrument with him but...
Follow the ears? Follow the whatever????

[Lowcee]

I LOVE my "modern" dependent Greenhoe GC5. It is fairly "custom": i.e., all red brass (except nickel trim and valve casings) with an annealed bell and soldered rim and a light weight (no tuning) slide. The F & D slides are longer than stock so I don't need to pull them. I believe Schilke will do what they can, within reason, to accommodate your needs – ask.

The stock leadpipes are fine, but I use a Brad Close nickel silver "Bert Herrick 62H" (because it reminds me of my old Herrick pipe I sold or can't find). I had Brad drop my mouthpiece further in than stock, à la George Roberts. In my dotage (I mean retirement), response and tone color are my prime directives – I can't testify to "projection" – it fills up my little studio nicely. I don't sit in the back row anymore. YMMV