Olds Bass Trombone F Levers - How did they get it SO Wrong

[TheConnArtist70H]

Happy New Year to everyone....hoping you are all having a nice break.

So - Over the years I like many Bass Trombonists have played on numerous Bass Bone models from the like's of
Bach / Conn / Yamaha being my main brands over the last 40 years and I've never had one single complaint about
any of them.

However, more recently I bought Two Olds singles, one being a 1960's S22 TIS and the other a 1970's P22 TIB both George Roberts models. Now I know the S22 has a smaller Valve section, but the F Lever / mechanism on this model is so bad that I find it hard to believe how Olds got it so wrong on all levels.

The P22 has the larger Valve which is great and Horn blows so open and warm, but again the F Lever mechanism whilst being better than the S22, still has that awkward reach where I sometime don't always hit the lower trigger range so have to over compensate for this longer reach.

My question is, why didn't Olds just fit the basic L Lever system like the above brands did rather than go with what they did. I'm pretty sure the Pro Artists who these were made for must of thought the same which I'm sure would
have made there decision to move onto other brands quite easy after a while.

I know I'm not alone here .

[Burgerbob]

Your guess is as good as mine. I have an excellent playing S24G right now that I would use more often if I could just hold and use it. Not only is it a bad lever, but it's placed like an inch farther back than it should be to boot.

[TheConnArtist70H]

Aidan - I feel for you Man, such good horns, you would have thought by the time they made the S24G that they would have learned by there mistakes but No, good old OLDS just kept their heads in the sand.

I would be curious to know if anyone has converted the Lever mechanism over to the L Lever - String system on any
of there own horns ? or if a conversion kit could be supplied ( Brad ) ??

[JohnL]

Pictures of a conversion Brad Close did for Ido Meshulam in this thread:
viewtopic.php?t=42661

There was a guy down San Diego with a P-24G that Robb Stewart had reworked, but I recall that he replaced the valves as well as the linkage.

I suppose I'm just used to them; I've been playing a P-24G since college (longer ago than I want to mention). I do have trouble with the second valve on the S-24G; mine doesn't have the standoff (removed? never there?), so if I'm not paying attention, there can be some interference between my shoulder and the lever. It's really a pain if you're using a plunger or a derby.

I also occasionally have trouble with the levers on my old dependents, but I could probably get used to it if I used one as a daily driver bass trombone (rather than as a "tweener" in a trombone choir).

[Fairlane57]

I like how the P 24G plays and yes, the triggers could be better. I found that after tweaking the thumb lever and adding a support it was easier to play. I also like that the tuning slides are interchangeable for changing the tuning of the second valve.

[JohnL]

I wonder if my grip is a bit unorthodox. Here's a pic:

P-24G Hand.jpg

You'll notice that my thumb is out at the very end of the lever.