Lubricant/oil for Bach Infinty (Olsen) axial flow valve

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ttf_Larry Preston Roberson
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Lubricant/oil for Bach Infinty (Olsen) axial flow valve

Post by ttf_Larry Preston Roberson » Thu Jan 18, 2018 12:19 am

I recently acquired a Bach 42AF. The instrument was pre-owned, but in like-new condition. The Instrument Innovations Axial Flow Trombone Valve (Infinity), is the finest axial flow valve I have tried. Having previously tried others, including the Thayer, I had always eschewed this type of valve. Anyway, I have yet to disassemble and clean the horn and valve. But I feel confident with the task—I do all my own maintenance and minor repairs. Anyone familiar with this valve, please feel free to comment what oil you would recommend. The only oil for rotors I currently have is Superslick Professional Key & Rotor Oil. This oil is all the local music store stocked. I've always used Superslick slide cream, but this oil leaves much to be desired for rotors—at least for Yamaha's close tolerances on horns and rotary tubas. For the Olsen (Infinity) valve, this oil is definitely too heavy/thick for the job. Said oil is fine for the ball joints/linkage, but makes the valve sluggish.
ttf_BGuttman
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Lubricant/oil for Bach Infinty (Olsen) axial flow valve

Post by ttf_BGuttman » Thu Jan 18, 2018 5:16 am

You should be using a trumpet valve oil for the direct lubrication of the core.  See the video from Edwards at the top of this board.  I would guess that your store stocks Al Cass oil (just about everybody does).  That's more of what you need.  The oil you have is really for the linkages.
ttf_bonearzt
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Lubricant/oil for Bach Infinty (Olsen) axial flow valve

Post by ttf_bonearzt » Thu Jan 18, 2018 5:19 am

I've had good luck with Al Cass on these valves,  and others have recommended the UltraPure oil.

But really any good quality oil will work but it does have to be as thin as you can find due to the tighter tolerances of the Olsen/Infinity valves.

And unlike the original axial valves,  there is no need to oil the spindle since it runs on a sealed bearing.

And don't forget to oil the linkages on occasion.


Eric

ttf_greenbean
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Lubricant/oil for Bach Infinty (Olsen) axial flow valve

Post by ttf_greenbean » Thu Jan 18, 2018 5:55 am

For sure - don't put that stuff in a valve of any type.  It is designed for spindles, linkages, keys, etc.

I would choose between Hetman Rotor #12 and Hetman Light Rotor #11.  But, really, this is a question for Olson...
ttf_Burgerbob
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Lubricant/oil for Bach Infinty (Olsen) axial flow valve

Post by ttf_Burgerbob » Thu Jan 18, 2018 1:02 pm

Ultra pure light.
ttf_daveyboy37
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Lubricant/oil for Bach Infinty (Olsen) axial flow valve

Post by ttf_daveyboy37 » Thu Jan 18, 2018 3:29 pm

Quote from: bonearzt on Jan 18, 2018, 05:19AMAnd unlike the original axial valves,  there is no need to oil the spindle since it runs on a sealed bearing.
I knew they were ball bearing, but they are sealed too? That's pretty awesome.  When my Aluminum Thayer finally goes, I'll definitely have to consider the olsen valve. Are the mounting dimensions the same?
ttf_bonearzt
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Lubricant/oil for Bach Infinty (Olsen) axial flow valve

Post by ttf_bonearzt » Thu Jan 18, 2018 4:04 pm

Quote from: daveyboy37 on Jan 18, 2018, 03:29PM I knew they were ball bearing, but they are sealed too? That's pretty awesome.  When my Aluminum Thayer finally goes, I'll definitely have to consider the olsen valve. Are the mounting dimensions the same?

Yep,  sealed bearings in the cone & spindle.
The dimensions are not the same,  especially with the port in the side of the casing.  So not a direct replacement,  takes some modding of the tubing to install.


Eric

ttf_anonymous
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Lubricant/oil for Bach Infinty (Olsen) axial flow valve

Post by ttf_anonymous » Sat Jan 20, 2018 7:19 pm

 Hello everyone
 I’ve had this question many many times and I generally answer it the same way .  You  can use most any oil you like but it needs to be as thin as possible . I originally thought that none of the synthetics would work very well as they tend to thicken a bit more than the petroleum based oil‘s although I have several people using the  Hetman light  and I believe also ultrapure in the light  in the lightest form possible . You must understand that this is a different valve than the axial flow that everyone else has had over the years . This valve will not leak and will not wear out.  The other valves needed the oil not only to prevent wear but to seal and as they would wear you would use thicker and thicker oil to continue to create the seal . These valves are not like that.  The only reason you need oil is to clean the saliva and residue that builds up in the valve  it also keeps  corrosion from building up . The oil is not needed to  prevent wear however it does quiet the valve.  if you use no oil at all the valve tends to be a bit noisy . A couple of drops of regular cheap thin petroleum based oil is generally all you need.  I’ve got guys that have not  cleaned their valve in over two years and things are going just fine . All they do is make sure to keep the thin oil in the valve.
Thank you
Mike Olsen
ttf_tbathras
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Lubricant/oil for Bach Infinty (Olsen) axial flow valve

Post by ttf_tbathras » Sat Jan 20, 2018 7:32 pm

I can’t cope with the smell of petroleum based oils, so I use Hetman’s #1 light piston oil on my bass with two Olsen axials.

Been working great and no odor.  A couple drops goes a long way.
ttf_Larry Preston Roberson
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Lubricant/oil for Bach Infinty (Olsen) axial flow valve

Post by ttf_Larry Preston Roberson » Sat Jan 20, 2018 8:39 pm

Quote from: BGuttman on Jan 18, 2018, 05:16AMSee the video from Edwards at the top of this board.
Thanks for bringing my attention to the link to the video, Bruce. I came across that video a few months ago on YouTube and watched it. It will be good to review before I service the valve.


ttf_Larry Preston Roberson
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Lubricant/oil for Bach Infinty (Olsen) axial flow valve

Post by ttf_Larry Preston Roberson » Sat Jan 20, 2018 8:47 pm

Quote from: greenbean on Jan 18, 2018, 05:55AMFor sure - don't put that stuff in a valve of any type.
Yeah, that probably explains why my freshly cleaned Yamaha F horn's valves move as "slow as molasses in January"—and it's January! I should have known better, but it would be nice if Superslick would label it spindle oil, etc.
ttf_Larry Preston Roberson
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Lubricant/oil for Bach Infinty (Olsen) axial flow valve

Post by ttf_Larry Preston Roberson » Sat Jan 20, 2018 9:00 pm

Quote from: Burgerbob on Jan 18, 2018, 01:02PMUltra pure light.
Locally, Sam Ash had Ultra pure Professional Valve oil in stock. Which, I assume is their regular weight. So, I'll try that for now.

Quote from: greenbean on Jan 18, 2018, 05:55AMI would choose between Hetman Rotor #12 and Hetman Light Rotor #11.
I may go ahead and order Hetman Light Rotor #11.

Quote from: greenbean on Jan 18, 2018, 05:55AMBut, really, this is a question for Olson...
Speaking of which...

Quote from: MOKO on Today at 07:19 PM...make sure to keep the thin oil in the valve.
Thank you
Mike Olsen
Thank you Mr. Olsen for posting to the thread and for the PM as well. Once again, the axial flow valve is a great product! And thanks to everyone else who chimed in.
ttf_Larry Preston Roberson
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Lubricant/oil for Bach Infinty (Olsen) axial flow valve

Post by ttf_Larry Preston Roberson » Sat Jan 20, 2018 9:00 pm

Quote from: Burgerbob on Jan 18, 2018, 01:02PMUltra pure light.
Locally, Sam Ash had Ultra pure Professional Valve oil in stock. Which, I assume is their regular weight. So, I'll try that for now.

Quote from: greenbean on Jan 18, 2018, 05:55AMI would choose between Hetman Rotor #12 and Hetman Light Rotor #11.
I may go ahead and order Hetman Light Rotor #11.

Quote from: greenbean on Jan 18, 2018, 05:55AMBut, really, this is a question for Olson...
Speaking of which...

Quote from: MOKO on Today at 07:19 PM...make sure to keep the thin oil in the valve.
Thank you
Mike Olsen
Thank you Mr. Olsen for posting to the thread and for the PM as well. Once again, the axial flow valve is a great product! And thanks to everyone else who chimed in.
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