Is it better to go slightly smaller or slightly bigger?

ttf_trb420 · Post by **ttf_trb420** » Fri Jun 09, 2017 4:13 pm

Sort of a nondescript title, I'm currently playing on a mouthpiece with a 1.02 inch rim, and I was looking to either switch to a Greg Black 4.5G-5G or 5G. The 4.5-5 has a 1.022 inch rim and the 5G has a 1.016 inch rim. I kno that small differences like that can feel like pretty big differences when playing, so I'm not sure which one would be more suitable (I like the 1.02 inch rim I play on, I just want a bigger cup and have heard good things about GB). Is there any site that would send me both, and I could send back the one I liked less? No stores near me carry them. Thanks!

ttf_TromboneMonkey · Post by **ttf_TromboneMonkey** » Fri Jun 09, 2017 7:41 pm

No two companies will have the same specs. Best to order them from Dillon and send the one you don't like back.

ttf_Doug Elliott · Post by **ttf_Doug Elliott** » Fri Jun 09, 2017 8:02 pm

I know you're not asking about my stuff but in case you are interested, I will be not far from you, in Palatine next Wednesday, 10-6 and I'll have all of my mouthpieces available to try.

ttf_BGuttman · Post by **ttf_BGuttman** » Fri Jun 09, 2017 8:12 pm

If you aren't sure, and you can't afford to buy both, choose one and buy it (eeny-meeny-miney-mo-...).

I'd be willing to bet that both of them are so close to what you play now it really doesn't matter.

I'd take Doug's offer up if I were you. He will figure out exactly which of his setups is comparable in depth to what you are playing now, and the two Blacks. He doesn't offer such fine differences in rims; you will find a 1.01", 1.02", and a 1.03" (nominally 5G, 4G, and 3G respectively)

ttf_robcat2075 · Post by **ttf_robcat2075** » Fri Jun 09, 2017 8:34 pm

QuoteThe 4.5-5 has a 1.022 inch rim and the 5G has a 1.016 inch rim.
That is a difference of 0.006 inch, less than the width of two very thin human hairs.

The difference between your current 1.02 and the 1.022 rim (1/500th of an inch) is less than a human hair and smaller than can be seen by the human eye.

If you are really looking for larger, is 1.022 going to be different enough to be different?

ttf_TromboneMonkey · Post by **ttf_TromboneMonkey** » Fri Jun 09, 2017 9:02 pm

Both of those could be smaller or larger than what he currently plays regardless of specs. I expect one of them would be noticeably too large or too small.

ttf_Doug Elliott · Post by **ttf_Doug Elliott** » Fri Jun 09, 2017 9:11 pm

.006 is definitely enough to feel.
The real point is that there are other differences at the same time... plus, measurements like that can (often) be inaccurate or just plain wrong, and they're not necessarily measured the same way at the same relative points.

As an example, a Bach 5G is specified at 1.004 but I would not measure most of them to be that size. And you're saying the GB 5G is specified at 1.016. There's more difference from 5G to 5G than to the 4G... ???

ttf_daveyboy37 · Post by **ttf_daveyboy37** » Tue Jun 13, 2017 1:22 pm

I would definitely take Doug up on his offer. He knows more about mouthpieces and fitting than anyone I have heard of. As he has said many times before, mouthpieces more often than not vary from their published specs, and the way that rims are measured is not uniform from maker to maker at all.

ttf_BillO · Post by **ttf_BillO** » Tue Jun 13, 2017 7:35 pm

Quote from: Doug Elliott on Jun 09, 2017, 08:02PMI know you're not asking about my stuff but in case you are interested, I will be not far from you, in Palatine next Wednesday, 10-6 and I'll have all of my mouthpieces available to try.
All of them? Wow! I wish I could attend.

To the OP - for sure, make time in your schedule to attend this. What an opportunity!!!!

ttf_sabutin · Post by **ttf_sabutin** » Wed Jun 14, 2017 8:36 am

Quote from: Doug Elliott on Jun 09, 2017, 08:02PMI know you're not asking about my stuff but in case you are interested, I will be not far from you, in Palatine next Wednesday, 10-6 and I'll have all of my mouthpieces available to try.

What he said.

S.

ttf_watermailonman · Post by **ttf_watermailonman** » Wed Jun 14, 2017 8:39 am

Quote from: trb420 on Jun 09, 2017, 04:13PMSort of a nondescript title, I'm currently playing on a mouthpiece with a 1.02 inch rim, and I was looking to either switch to a Greg Black 4.5G-5G or 5G. The 4.5-5 has a 1.022 inch rim and the 5G has a 1.016 inch rim. I kno that small differences like that can feel like pretty big differences when playing, so I'm not sure which one would be more suitable (I like the 1.02 inch rim I play on, I just want a bigger cup and have heard good things about GB). Is there any site that would send me both, and I could send back the one I liked less? No stores near me carry them. Thanks!

Don't look too much on specifications. You have to play the mouthpieces to know. You might end up as most gear-guys do, with a bunch of mouthpieces. The rim or more specific the edge is what I find most important. Either they work or they don't work, or they need too much time to adopt to. Karl Hammond has a variety of high quality mouthpieces. I guess you could return the ones you don't want Just ask him.

/Tom

ttf_hyperbolica · Post by **ttf_hyperbolica** » Wed Jun 14, 2017 9:43 am

I think i might stick out in a real salsa band, but then I know a guy who does play salsa on a 525/547 Getzen with a 12c. Each genre will accept a range of sound, range becomes limited when you work with a section. I play in places where a big fat sound is acceptable or even preferred, so I get away with it. Years ago I tried to practice smaller mouthpieces into submission, but the bigger rims are just easier to play for me. If I need a smaller sound, I use a smaller cup, shank, and/or horn. If I were a better player (had unlimited time to practice) I could swap mouthpieces at will like some of you, but unless I quit my day job, I've got to work with what I have. I'm not trying to convince anyone that big rims on everything is the way to go, just thats what works for me.

ttf_hyperbolica · Post by **ttf_hyperbolica** » Wed Jun 14, 2017 9:43 am

I think i might stick out in a real salsa band, but then I know a guy who does play salsa on a 525/547 Getzen with a 12c. Each genre will accept a range of sound, range becomes limited when you work with a section. I play in places where a big fat sound is acceptable or even preferred, so I get away with it. Years ago I tried to practice smaller mouthpieces into submission, but the bigger rims are just easier to play for me. If I need a smaller sound, I use a smaller cup, shank, and/or horn. If I were a better player (had unlimited time to practice) I could swap mouthpieces at will like some of you, but unless I quit my day job, I've got to work with what I have. I'm not trying to convince anyone that big rims on everything is the way to go, just thats what works for me.