Snobby trumpet guy

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JCBone
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Snobby trumpet guy

Post by JCBone » Sun Apr 11, 2021 2:57 pm

https://youtu.be/WJQPlHzYk2A
What do you think?
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ArbanRubank
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Re: Snobby trumpet guy

Post by ArbanRubank » Sun Apr 11, 2021 3:19 pm

A tongue what embouchure?
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Kingfan
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Re: Snobby trumpet guy

Post by Kingfan » Sun Apr 11, 2021 3:54 pm

A thought all trumpet players were snobby :-)
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Re: Snobby trumpet guy

Post by harrisonreed » Sun Apr 11, 2021 4:40 pm

He sounds like a certain former "world leader"
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ArbanRubank
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Re: Snobby trumpet guy

Post by ArbanRubank » Sun Apr 11, 2021 5:03 pm

Lol. I noticed that as well.

So I wonder what brand he advocates.

He can go back to it and I'll go back, I'll go back to Bach.
Doubler
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Re: Snobby trumpet guy

Post by Doubler » Sun Apr 11, 2021 9:40 pm

He recommends Callet mouthpieces, because they work for him. More "Power" to him. Perhaps Bach mouthpieces work for other players, ya think?
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Ted
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Re: Snobby trumpet guy

Post by Ted » Sun Apr 11, 2021 11:46 pm

The comments in the comment sections are hilarious.
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Re: Snobby trumpet guy

Post by harrisonreed » Mon Apr 12, 2021 4:11 am

I threw a few in there
JCBone
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Re: Snobby trumpet guy

Post by JCBone » Mon Apr 12, 2021 9:53 am

Seems like his whole teaching philosophy is 'get a new mouthpiece'
Posaunus
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Re: Snobby trumpet guy

Post by Posaunus » Mon Apr 12, 2021 12:54 pm

The "snobby trumpet guy" is Ralph Salamone, who is promoting trumpet mouthpieces from Jerome Callet.

Not surprising, since he is, since the death of Mr. Callet in 2019, now the "exclusive dealer" for Callet mouthpieces using the name "True Power:"
http://www.tpwr.org/callet.html

Why does Salamone unreservedly trash all Bach trumpet mouthpieces? Because he wants to sell you one of his Callet mouthpieces. The entire video is an ad.

Full disclosure: I've actually tried a Callet trombone mouthpiece - a Magnum 7B.
(Heavy weight. Long, slightly oversize shank. Like a deep cup, large-throat Bach 6¾ or Bach 7?)
It didn't do anything for me. :frown:
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imsevimse
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Re: Snobby trumpet guy

Post by imsevimse » Mon Apr 12, 2021 1:16 pm

I see this as an example of a silly talk 🤣

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BGuttman
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Re: Snobby trumpet guy

Post by BGuttman » Mon Apr 12, 2021 1:56 pm

Posaunus wrote:
Mon Apr 12, 2021 12:54 pm
...

Full disclosure: I've actually tried a Callet trombone mouthpiece - a Magnum 7B.
(Heavy weight. Long, slightly oversize shank. Like a deep cup, large-throat Bach 6¾ or Bach 7?)
It didn't do anything for me. :frown:
I have a Callet 26 Something. Bought it directly from Callet at a seminar. About 4G size. It's in the drawer. I paid $130 for it. Not worth that. Too heavy and not responsive. Btw, Callet was not as egotistical as this guy.
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robcat2075
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Re: Snobby trumpet guy

Post by robcat2075 » Mon Apr 12, 2021 2:07 pm

I didn't perceive him as snobby, he seemed sincere, but I have no way to assess the merit of his claims.

The story of the fourth trumpet who has to ice his lips sounds pretty dire indeed, but is that the mouthpiece's fault?

What is the meaning of the stuff he's playing under the black for the last several minutes? That sounded awful.
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Re: Snobby trumpet guy

Post by Elow » Mon Apr 12, 2021 2:17 pm

I don’t know how someone can watch that, and then take a mouthpiece recommendation from him. Especially at the end, i wouldn’t trust anyone who sounds like that. Even on a trash mouthpiece. I’m surprised he didn’t talk about how gold plate makes his double c easier to play.
JCBone
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Re: Snobby trumpet guy

Post by JCBone » Mon Apr 12, 2021 2:31 pm

For someone who claims to have played with the MET. There is no way he was playing the Arbans in the end to the best of his ability. A pro, even with unideal equipment, should still be able sound musical.
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Re: Snobby trumpet guy

Post by CalgaryTbone » Mon Apr 12, 2021 11:40 pm

JCBone wrote:
Mon Apr 12, 2021 2:31 pm
For someone who claims to have played with the MET. There is no way he was playing the Arbans in the end to the best of his ability. A pro, even with unideal equipment, should still be able sound musical.
It wasn't "at" the Met - it was busking out in front of the building. He was ushered away by the cops.

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Re: Snobby trumpet guy

Post by Kbiggs » Tue Apr 13, 2021 10:00 am

There was a thread here on TC a while ago about this fellow. IIRC, consensus here (which is, no doubt, the final word on every major topic of discussion you’d care to find) was that his teaching and playing were... unorthodox. To me, his sound is very bright and unpleasant.

Having said that, I’ve been reading a little about this so-called “tongue controlled embouchure.” Apparently, there is some indication that this was practiced in the Baroque trumpet world. I’d have to dig out my old notes and search my browser history...
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BGuttman
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Re: Snobby trumpet guy

Post by BGuttman » Tue Apr 13, 2021 10:30 am

Jerry Callet advocated a tongue controlled embouchure. I tried it after that session I attended and decided it wasn't for me.
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Re: Snobby trumpet guy

Post by harrisonreed » Tue Apr 13, 2021 10:40 am

Kbiggs wrote:
Tue Apr 13, 2021 10:00 am
There was a thread here on TC a while ago about this fellow. IIRC, consensus here (which is, no doubt, the final word on every major topic of discussion you’d care to find) was that his teaching and playing were... unorthodox. To me, his sound is very bright and unpleasant.

Having said that, I’ve been reading a little about this so-called “tongue controlled embouchure.” Apparently, there is some indication that this was practiced in the Baroque trumpet world. I’d have to dig out my old notes and search my browser history...
My tongue controls a lot of my embouchure, but not in the way he describes.
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robcat2075
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Re: Snobby trumpet guy

Post by robcat2075 » Tue Apr 13, 2021 10:57 am

Here is a website on Tongue Controlled Embouchure

I have no idea as to the merits. It must work for someone as they seem quite dedicated to it.

"The vast majority of brass teaching is just the perpetuation of anecdotes, trepidation and mythology..."
I have certainly had that impression at times. :D They have my attention now.

"The terms Einsetzen and Ansetzen are words that originate in ancient french horn technique..."
French so ancient, it looks like German! I'm beginning to have doubts...
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timothy42b
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Re: Snobby trumpet guy

Post by timothy42b » Tue Apr 13, 2021 11:16 am

I didn't mind the head being cut off (dude, check your camera!) but where do you get Penn State sweatshirts printed mirror image? I want one.
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LeTromboniste
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Re: Snobby trumpet guy

Post by LeTromboniste » Tue Apr 13, 2021 4:00 pm

Kbiggs wrote:
Tue Apr 13, 2021 10:00 am
Having said that, I’ve been reading a little about this so-called “tongue controlled embouchure.” Apparently, there is some indication that this was practiced in the Baroque trumpet world. I’d have to dig out my old notes and search my browser history...
I don't think so. Bahb Civiletti, a NYC-based baroque trumpet player and former student of Callet, is an advocate of "tongue-controlled embouchure". I assume there are other baroque trumpet players today that use that technique, but I'm not aware that it's any more the norm as it is in the modern trumpet scene. And I don't know of any evidence supporting that it was historically the dominant technique in the baroque era. On the contrary, as far as I can tell TCE appears to be incompatible with the tonguing styles in both Fantini (1638) and Altenburg (1795), the two trumpet method writers that bookend the baroque period. (try saying "tiritiriton" with you tongue touching your lips. Good luck!)

His claim in terms of it being historical is basically: the trumpet guild secrets are lost forever so we'll never no for sure, but that's how I am able to play those hard Bach, L Mozart, Reutter and M Haydn parts, and I'm so good at it, therefore that *must* be what they were doing back then too...This of course is not based on historical sources, ignores that other players can actually play baroque trumpet really well without using TCE, and also ignores the fact that he doesn't actually play the instrument those parts were written for (i.e. he plays baroque trumpet with holes, not natural trumpet, that makes an enormous difference in terms of embouchure).
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Re: Snobby trumpet guy

Post by Basbasun » Wed Apr 14, 2021 2:46 am

It is possible to sound crappy on any mpc.
We do not know how the great trumpet players played. Some modern trumpet player do play with TCE emboure. Most trumpet players don´t. It does work for some, not for me in the "normal" range. I use the tongue on a forward setting on tones above my normal range.
This guy is something else. He should have a prize.
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Re: Snobby trumpet guy

Post by timothy42b » Wed Apr 14, 2021 5:49 am

I lost patience before I got to the part about tongue controlled.

But arched tongue is not something weird, and even the dorsal tonguing or K-Tonguing with the tip anchored below the bottom teeth come from mainstream trumpeters like Claude Gordon and Herbert Clarke.
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Re: Snobby trumpet guy

Post by Kbiggs » Wed Apr 14, 2021 10:54 am

LeTromboniste wrote:
Tue Apr 13, 2021 4:00 pm
Kbiggs wrote:
Tue Apr 13, 2021 10:00 am
Having said that, I’ve been reading a little about this so-called “tongue controlled embouchure.” Apparently, there is some indication that this was practiced in the Baroque trumpet world. I’d have to dig out my old notes and search my browser history...
I don't think so. Bahb Civiletti, a NYC-based baroque trumpet player and former student of Callet, is an advocate of "tongue-controlled embouchure". I assume there are other baroque trumpet players today that use that technique, but I'm not aware that it's any more the norm as it is in the modern trumpet scene. And I don't know of any evidence supporting that it was historically the dominant technique in the baroque era. On the contrary, as far as I can tell TCE appears to be incompatible with the tonguing styles in both Fantini (1638) and Altenburg (1795), the two trumpet method writers that bookend the baroque period. (try saying "tiritiriton" with you tongue touching your lips. Good luck!)

His claim in terms of it being historical is basically: the trumpet guild secrets are lost forever so we'll never no for sure, but that's how I am able to play those hard Bach, L Mozart, Reutter and M Haydn parts, and I'm so good at it, therefore that *must* be what they were doing back then too...This of course is not based on historical sources, ignores that other players can actually play baroque trumpet really well without using TCE, and also ignores the fact that he doesn't actually play the instrument those parts were written for (i.e. he plays baroque trumpet with holes, not natural trumpet, that makes an enormous difference in terms of embouchure).
Gulp! I was wrong. It’s nice to know that someone out there actually cares about correcting the gaps in my education! :good:
I have known a great many troubles, but most of them have never happened.
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robcat2075
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Re: Snobby trumpet guy

Post by robcat2075 » Wed Apr 14, 2021 2:07 pm

My initial attempt to play with my tongue on my lower lip produces almost no usable sound. :D

Do we know of any trombone players who subscribe to this technique?
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timothy42b
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Re: Snobby trumpet guy

Post by timothy42b » Wed Apr 14, 2021 2:14 pm

robcat2075 wrote:
Wed Apr 14, 2021 2:07 pm
My initial attempt to play with my tongue on my lower lip produces almost no usable sound. :D

Do we know of any trombone players who subscribe to this technique?
A lot of people probably use a little tongue to brace and support the lower lip without realizing it.

Also people with a short tongue who do the dorsal tongue might end up with the tip there.
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robcat2075
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Re: Snobby trumpet guy

Post by robcat2075 » Wed Apr 14, 2021 2:30 pm

Here's a diagram they offer. That's a lot of tongue.

Image
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robcat2075
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Re: Snobby trumpet guy

Post by robcat2075 » Wed Apr 14, 2021 4:35 pm

It maketh me thound like I'm lithping.
>>Robert Holmén<<

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Basbasun
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Re: Snobby trumpet guy

Post by Basbasun » Thu Apr 15, 2021 2:50 am

Ha ha! Yes that is a funny picture! I don´t think there are many people who can do it like that. Maybe if I could do that I may get an fantastic high range on my basstrombone! I try !
(No I am not serious)
I do know very good trumpet players who use the TCE though.
Basbasun
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Re: Snobby trumpet guy

Post by Basbasun » Thu Apr 15, 2021 2:53 am

We all know of many good trumpet players who play Bach pieces. Who is he trying to fool?
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Re: Snobby trumpet guy

Post by Basbasun » Thu Apr 15, 2021 5:37 am

Some trumpeters plac Bach 7C with false teeth.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1dqL5RoIqqI
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Re: Snobby trumpet guy

Post by Thrawn22 » Thu Apr 15, 2021 1:15 pm

Still better than Kurt Thompson.
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Re: Snobby trumpet guy

Post by dershem » Fri Apr 16, 2021 8:55 pm

As good a teacher as he is a videographer. :D
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