Bach bass valves on Edwards

[LarryPrestonRoberson]

Would it be a fairly straightforward modification, relatively speaking, to adapt a Bach 50B3O valve section (independent rotors) to mate up with Edwards bass components? In other words, build an Edwards bass around said valve section—bell, tuning slide, slide, etc. Ideally, it would be useful to retain modularity with other Edwards valve sections.

Please feel free to comment with any experience you’ve had with this or knowledge of this being done. And maybe venture an estimate of costs involved, assuming one already had the Bach valve section, and Edwards’ bell and main tuning slide.

Technicians, feel free to chime in and/or email or PM me.

[Kbiggs]

I’m sure that with enough money it could be done. Aside from the reason, “because it can be done,” why would you want to?

I’m not a tech, but I know that Bach and Edwards have very different rates of expansion (expansion profiles?) throughout the bell section. Standard Bach rotary valves are quite narrow and can feel “stuffy” compared to Edwards axial flow valves. Finally, Edwards are desinged with a long bell section and short slide section compared to Bachs. My experience and two cents says that Edwards and Bachs are like apples and oranges in the bass trombone world.

So, why would you want to do this?

[elmsandr]

Take the worst part of the Bach horn and build an Edwards around it? Why?

Half the reason Edwards exist is to replace the valve sections on Bach horns.

But for real, yes, you could. Need the ferrule and inner tuning slide and some disconnect braces that you can get from OE Thayer. I still wouldn’t do it except as a backup section, but you could. Note that the two main braces have a different spacing on Edwards compared to Bach, but that isn’t a huge deal to move the front one.

Cheers,
Andy

[mrdeacon]

If you've got the dough... you could buy two Olsen rotors and make an indy setup for Edwards.

Might be a bit more expensive than buying a spare used 50BO3 valve section and adapting to fit but it'll be a boatload cheaper than buying a rotor setup from Edwards new.

[Matt K]

If you've got the dough... you could buy two Olsen rotors and make an indy setup for Edwards.

Might be a bit more expensive than buying a spare used 50BO3 valve section and adapting to fit but it'll be a boatload cheaper than buying a rotor setup from Edwards new.

Unfortunately, it isn't quite that simple. The Olsen rotors are differently angled than the Bach so the tubing isn't exactly a drop-in replacement... it takes some engineering. Just worked through a bunch of those problems with my tech. Not impossible by any stretch and also still cheaper than a $2800 set of rotors but also not as simple as using the existing rotors.

That all said, I haven't played on my Olsens yet but they obviously get very good reviews. I will say that I have some experience with refitting bach rotors and when they're fitted appropriately they are extremely efficient playing. I have one on my Shires tenor (the dependent one) and it has a great low register. You aren't going to confuse it for ab ass--- well actually, most of the people I play with who aren't trombone players (and even some trombonists) think it sounds fine as that too at least for commercial stuff. I wouldn't let that deter me but I also wouldn't let he cost be the sole factor in makign somethign liek this because it isn't going to be cheap

[mrdeacon]

Ahh MattK maybe I didn't word my post the best.

I didn't so much mean put Olsen valves on a 50B3O section... because like you said that would take some finagling. But most techs have a stockpile of spare parts. If you take the valves to someone like John Sandhagen, Ben Hansen or Eric Edwards they can build a valve section for you from scratch as long as you provide them the valves.

They might have to buy some parts but depending on how you want the wrap designed sometimes it's easier to do that than to drop and plug and drop valves in an existing section! All questions for your tech though. Some do prefer to fit valves to an already built section.