88h questions

[MIAbone]

I acquired an 88h in a trade. no engraving on the bell, valve section has matching 3 digit serials on the valve and both tunings, the slide a 4 digit (placed under the male tenon and on the outer slide stocking).slide has springs as well. the horn valve section had a major repair it seems to salvage it and put a slide receiver from a different conn 88h. it works but gets a stuffy sound. question is how old is this horn with the given info. the serial on the slide receiver is 38 251xxx, but like I said this receiver is not of this horn.

[BGuttman]

It's not that old; the number appears to be the one where it encodes decade, year, month, etc. which is no more than 20 years old. The 3 digit and 4 digit numbers are not the serial numbers; they are just part numbers used in the assembly.

The lack of any kind of engraving on the bell also indicates it's fairly recent. But it should say something like "CONN Artist" or the like.

The stuffiness could be due to bad alignment of the rotor. You might want to have a tech look it over.

[greenbean]

Well, the slide receiver is from 1988...

But we really need photos to tell you anything about the rest of it.

[MIAbone]

here you go

https://www.dropbox.com/sh/51u524q3tpt4 ... arowa?dl=0

[BGuttman]

Must have been a school horn. Somebody tried to strengthen the F-attachment for marching with those two bars.

The layout of the Conn 88H hasn't changed from the days of the "customized" 8H so looking at braces and tubing won't help date the thing.

And you say there is NOTHING on the bell? No engraving of any kind?

If it's not red brass, it's got to be relatively later, but the tenon already indicates that.

[MIAbone]

I cant even tell. ima take a better picture with some daylight. but no engravings whatsoever or any stamps of any sort.

[greenbean]

No engraving on bell? I would say a replacement bell...

I am thinking the valve is from the 1990s. Up through the 1980's (?), the Conn valves had two removable bearing plates. This one has one bearing plate soldered on. But it doesn't look like the Gen II (King) valve and cap that appeared in the early 2000s.

The receiver came from another horn.

The slide? Anytime before 2000-ish. I have never seen a 4-digit serial # like that. But everything about the slide looks like a stock 88H slide. I wonder if the number on the slide is really a production #. Some Kings had a 4-digit production number on inner & outer - the horn that had the serial # on the bell section. Maybe the slide and receiver go together?!... Who knows!!

[MIAbone]

The receiver does not mate well with the slide

[greenbean]

I edited my post above to correct my statement about the trigger saddle. (Never mind.)

The receiver does not mate well with the slide

Yeah, I think the receiver is from a non-88H. Possibly a King/Benge, but those have threads that would have had to have been modified. Does it look like a "lip" was soldered onto the receiver to retain the lock nut?...

[imsevimse]

If I remember correctly you should add 50 to the first two digits (38) to get the year. I know this is what Benge did and I think Conn did too. I have a Conn 6h "Victor" with a serial number where I suspect the two first digits are used the same even though there is no following space between the rest of the serial. With this method the slide is made in 1988.

/Tom

[MIAbone]

I edited my post above to correct my statement about the trigger saddle. (Never mind.)

The receiver does not mate well with the slide

Yeah, I think the receiver is from a non-88H. Possibly a King/Benge, but those have threads that would have had to have been modified. Does it look like a "lip" was soldered onto the receiver to retain the lock nut?...

nope. the bell looks reddish with a hue of that weird yellow/gold

[Matt K]

As someone else mentioned, I believe if you get a replacement bell they come unengraved. In either case, it sounds like you have a frankenhorn. Sometimes they turn out great... I have several such horns. Sometimes they... don't. I've had several of those horns as well. Someone mentioned not too long ago here that band parents often haggle on price and professionals don't. Makes sense; their kids activities are basically always a net loss and a lot of kids do band because it's fun and they have friends in it but they have no professional aspirations. At least that's been my interaction with a lot of parents. So in an attempt to save a few bucks the conversation probably went something like:

Repair Tech: "Yeah, so when they decided to joust with the slide, they basically wrecked the bell section. Though miraculously, the tuning slide still functions and most of the tubing is intact. So that'll be $800 to get this into working shape."

Band parent: "That's ridiculous! Don't you have any parts 'lying around'?"

Repair Tech: "Um... technically we do have a Blessing slide receiver and some unused bell in the back... that would sort-of work. And instead of replacing the valve, you could solder these two giant rods to it and hope for the best. If we do all that... you could save like $.38."

Band parent: "That's a smaller number than the first number! Let's do that."

Repair Tech: "Okay... your call."

So what you have is probably impossible to know though if you had someone disassemble it who was familiar with a variety of parts, they could probably make a reasonably educated guess. That would also probably make the horn play better too. If it were in my hands... I'd probably swap out the valve section and have them re-mount the bell, and have them chem clean the other parts while they're disassembled. Possibly replace any parts that don't fit well together. They aren't *that* expensive. You also might want to try to find someone else with an 88 and swap the bell and the slide and play both combinations. Might be able to isolate the problem a little better that way.

[MIAbone]

As someone else mentioned, I believe if you get a replacement bell they come unengraved. In either case, it sounds like you have a frankenhorn. Sometimes they turn out great... I have several such horns. Sometimes they... don't. I've had several of those horns as well. Someone mentioned not too long ago here that band parents often haggle on price and professionals don't. Makes sense; their kids activities are basically always a net loss and a lot of kids do band because it's fun and they have friends in it but they have no professional aspirations. At least that's been my interaction with a lot of parents. So in an attempt to save a few bucks the conversation probably went something like:

Repair Tech: "Yeah, so when they decided to joust with the slide, they basically wrecked the bell section. Though miraculously, the tuning slide still functions and most of the tubing is intact. So that'll be $800 to get this into working shape."

Band parent: "That's ridiculous! Don't you have any parts 'lying around'?"

Repair Tech: "Um... technically we do have a Blessing slide receiver and some unused bell in the back... that would sort-of work. And instead of replacing the valve, you could solder these two giant rods to it and hope for the best. If we do all that... you could save like $.38."

Band parent: "That's a smaller number than the first number! Let's do that."

Repair Tech: "Okay... your call."

So what you have is probably impossible to know though if you had someone disassemble it who was familiar with a variety of parts, they could probably make a reasonably educated guess. That would also probably make the horn play better too. If it were in my hands... I'd probably swap out the valve section and have them re-mount the bell, and have them chem clean the other parts while they're disassembled. Possibly replace any parts that don't fit well together. They aren't *that* expensive. You also might want to try to find someone else with an 88 and swap the bell and the slide and play both combinations. Might be able to isolate the problem a little better that way.

I may have to do that at this point.

[JohnL]

I'm inclined to suspect that there is something going on with the valve. Beyond the obvious (i.e., check the alignment), it looks like someone had to patch at least one knuckle back together, and they may not have done a stellar job.

[MIAbone]

I'm inclined to suspect that there is something going on with the valve. Beyond the obvious (i.e., check the alignment), it looks like someone had to patch at least one knuckle back together, and they may not have done a stellar job.

that is exactly what it looks like. the inside looks bad. so I may have to either get a new valve and receiver or sell real cheap to someone who is up for the job. unfortunately.