The (occasional) joys of eBay gambling/buying blind

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LeTromboniste
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The (occasional) joys of eBay gambling/buying blind

Post by LeTromboniste »

So I thought earlier this summer to start this thread but then completely forgot. Buying horns on eBay (and buying blind in general) can lead to disappointment, it can also lead to great surprises. The idea of this thread is to share stories or info about the particularly good (or particularly horrible) horns we score on eBay or buy blind, or our experience in general doing that.

My experience thus far : I've bought a few horns on eBay and other reselling sites, some were dogs, some were okay, and some were absolutely superb right off the bat (my first horn, which I still own but don't use much anymore, turned out to be one of the best 42s I've tried, got improved later on with various mods, and its slide gets complimented for its smootheness and fast action by everyone who tries it).

Now the horn that reminded me about this idea of a thread : last June I bought a 19th century Courtois for 180€ off of eBay.fr - it caught my attention notably because it came with a mouthpiece and a case, both likely contemporary.

Image

After getting more pictures from the seller, I was on the fence. The inner slide handbrace was completely severed from the lower tube and there were a few nasty dents on the tuning bow. On the other hand, the inner tubes seemed remarkably straight, with no corrosion or dents, really a promising condition given its age (the engraving on the bell dates it sometime between 1889 and 1895). I took a gamble. There were a few other problems once it arrived. The tuning slide was stuck, and there was a fingernail-sized spot on one of the outer tubes, just past the sleeve, where the metal was literally paper-thin and you could feel it crackle and give under your finger.

It just came back from a week at Musikhaus Gilhaus in Freiburg, and I couldn't commend their work more. They rebuilt and carefully aligned the slide as good as was possible, made a long bottom sleeve to replace the original shorter one and cover/reinforce the weak spot, pulled the tuning slide, took the dents out and polished the whole instrument. I now have a very nice, great sounding romantic French trombone in good playable condition, for less than 400€ total!

Image

It is all brass, with soldered-on stockings. It has a tiny bell (a bit below 7") and bore (somewhere around .460"), but it can actually sound really big. It's got amazing projection and gives a lot of feedback (the metal is quite thin). I've never had this much fun playing Bolero before, and playing a few bits of Guilmant, Barat, Stojowski was a revelation. These pieces have tons of character on this horn. It came with an unmarked, raw brass, typical 19th century French mouthpiece : absolutely tiny cup diameter by modern standards, very funneled, almost completely conical cup. I also use another mouthpiece with it (also Courtois, and contemporary) which I suspect is originally for baritone saxhorn, although it might also be for bass trombone.

Interestingly, the tuning slide is extra long - all the way in, the horn is at A=450 and all the way out it's at A=430 (give or take a few Hertz depending on the mouthpiece). Bell past 4th position at the higher pitch (like earlier trombones), 3rd position when at 430; and at 440, 4th position is pretty much exactly at the bell rim.

Other interesting features : the waterkey, typical for that time, and more importantly, the bell is 2 parts, with a Y seam (meaning it's not a flare and a stem - the main sheet goes all the way to the edge, but not all the way around, and is completed with a triangular piece of brass). Unfortunately I can't get a clear picture of that.

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Maximilien Brisson
www.maximilienbrisson.com
Lecturer for baroque trombone,
Hfk Bremen/University of the Arts Bremen
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Kingfan
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Re: The (occasional) joys of eBay gambling/buying blind

Post by Kingfan »

Great find! I was able to get a King 4B-F for $400 USD off eBay. I took a gamble on it - the seller had zero feedback, which is probably why there was very little bidding. The seller answered all my questions and send additional photos as requested, I won the auction. The horn isn't pretty but it is a great player.
I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are still missing! :D
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Finetales
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Re: The (occasional) joys of eBay gambling/buying blind

Post by Finetales »

I've gotten a ton of great deals from eBay and Craigslist. I haven't been let down once yet.

From eBay:

My first trombone (and first instrument of any kind I bought myself) - a Holton 66 Galaxy for $90
Flugabone - $67
Mellophonium - $100
Frumpet - $110
Cornet - $120
Trumpet (now sold) - $160
C trumpet - $85
Lidl rotary bass trumpet - $330
My first double French horn - $400

From Craigslist:

My first bass trombone (now sold), a Getzen
My current bass trombone
My current trumpet, an uncommon '68 Conn - $50 from a farmer in the middle of nowhere, Illinois
My current daily driver double French horn (still have the other one)

I have a B&H compensating Eb tuba on the way from eBay as we speak that I'm very excited about. I've gotten plenty of mutes and non-brass instruments (synthesizers) from eBay as well, and bought and sold several instruments through the TTF Classifieds. All good! Everything I've bought has been for a screaming deal and they have all served me well - even the $85 Chinese C trumpet which I have happily used on plenty of gigs. I could never afford to double all these instruments if I had to pay market price for them!
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Re: The (occasional) joys of eBay gambling/buying blind

Post by blast »

Just got Rath R9 bell on eBay. Great bell in great condition. Just what I was looking for. Delighted.

Chris
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LeTromboniste
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Re: The (occasional) joys of eBay gambling/buying blind

Post by LeTromboniste »

Finetales wrote: Sun Sep 16, 2018 11:57 pm I've gotten a ton of great deals from eBay and Craigslist. I haven't been let down once yet.

From eBay:

My first trombone (and first instrument of any kind I bought myself) - a Holton 66 Galaxy for $90
Flugabone - $67
Mellophonium - $100
Frumpet - $110
Cornet - $120
Trumpet (now sold) - $160
C trumpet - $85
Lidl rotary bass trumpet - $330
My first double French horn - $400

From Craigslist:

My first bass trombone (now sold), a Getzen
My current bass trombone
My current trumpet, an uncommon '68 Conn - $50 from a farmer in the middle of nowhere, Illinois
My current daily driver double French horn (still have the other one)

I have a B&H compensating Eb tuba on the way from eBay as we speak that I'm very excited about. I've gotten plenty of mutes and non-brass instruments (synthesizers) from eBay as well, and bought and sold several instruments through the TTF Classifieds. All good! Everything I've bought has been for a screaming deal and they have all served me well - even the $85 Chinese C trumpet which I have happily used on plenty of gigs. I could never afford to double all these instruments if I had to pay market price for them!
Wow all these low prices! How do you do that? That's a lot of savings!
Maximilien Brisson
www.maximilienbrisson.com
Lecturer for baroque trombone,
Hfk Bremen/University of the Arts Bremen
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Matt K
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Re: The (occasional) joys of eBay gambling/buying blind

Post by Matt K »

Patience! :wink:
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Re: The (occasional) joys of eBay gambling/buying blind

Post by Kbiggs »

That is a beautiful instrument!
Kenneth Biggs
I have known a great many troubles, but most of them have never happened.
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Finetales
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Re: The (occasional) joys of eBay gambling/buying blind

Post by Finetales »

LeTromboniste wrote: Mon Sep 17, 2018 4:57 am Wow all these low prices! How do you do that? That's a lot of savings!
What Matt K said! Patience and diligence. I have all my eBay brass searches sent through one RSS feed so any time a new listing that gets posted it shows up. It lets me check absolutely everything I could be interested in on eBay in about 2 minutes per day, instead of doing individual searches and taking a lot longer. I usually go many months in between purchases and don't pull the trigger on a lot of things I want to. But when an unbelievable deal shows up (that $67 flugabone was Buy It Now!) I don't have to hesitate for a second.
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Re: The (occasional) joys of eBay gambling/buying blind

Post by SwissTbone »

I do the best deals off ebay but on other reselling sites.
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Re: The (occasional) joys of eBay gambling/buying blind

Post by BassBoneWadie99 »

Speaking of which, there has been a lot of interesting listings that had/have been posted on there lately. There was a Holton E185 (with the slot-in second valve), a couple of King Duo Gravis Silversonics, King 5B Silversonic (looks to be a 1485), a Greenhoe Bach 42, and a couple of Courtois bones as well!

It seems to be open season for us! :biggrin: :pant:
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Re: The (occasional) joys of eBay gambling/buying blind

Post by SwissTbone »

Yeah it seems to be a great period for buying some rare or high end horns!

I am looking at a rath r9 with sterling silver bell right now. 5500 usd... doesn't seem that bad.
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Re: The (occasional) joys of eBay gambling/buying blind

Post by SteveP »

cozzagiorgi wrote: Mon Sep 17, 2018 10:22 am I do the best deals off ebay but on other reselling sites.
Such as?

I used to follow items on the Goodwill site but gave it up after too many other people discovered it. Great place to snatch a deal, for a while anyway.
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Re: The (occasional) joys of eBay gambling/buying blind

Post by SwissTbone »

SteveP wrote: Tue Sep 18, 2018 10:19 pm
cozzagiorgi wrote: Mon Sep 17, 2018 10:22 am I do the best deals off ebay but on other reselling sites.
Such as?

I used to follow items on the Goodwill site but gave it up after too many other people discovered it. Great place to snatch a deal, for a while anyway.
Actually all kind of reselling sites in a lot of different countries and in different languages. Quite easy here in europe.

Last deal I made was on OLX Portugal. Although I have never been to portugal nor do I speak portuguese.
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Re: The (occasional) joys of eBay gambling/buying blind

Post by SwissTbone »

SteveP wrote: Tue Sep 18, 2018 10:19 pm
cozzagiorgi wrote: Mon Sep 17, 2018 10:22 am I do the best deals off ebay but on other reselling sites.
Such as?
One example: This one could be fun to get more info on:
https://www.kijiji.ca/v-brass-instrumen ... nFlag=true

Note the mouthpiece engraving... and the horn might be from a good period... anyone said Elkhart?
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Re: The (occasional) joys of eBay gambling/buying blind

Post by Finetales »

German eBay is also a great place to look.
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Re: The (occasional) joys of eBay gambling/buying blind

Post by shider »

Finetales wrote: Wed Sep 19, 2018 9:52 pm German eBay is also a great place to look.
Yes, sometimes people here don't know much about the american brands, which results in different scenarios:
- an old, beat up King 606 or similar instrument for a shockingly high amount of money because the seller somewhere heard of the famous King instruments and how sought after they are..
- King 2b/3b/4b (and their derivatives) for cheap because the seller does't know what they are

But to get to pull the trigger on the second case one needs a LOT of patience..

PS: I chose King as an example, because they are readily available here, not as rare as the boutique custom horns and often played by amateurs who bought the only trombone the local music store (which might otherwise only trade in guitars and the like) had in the window and don't know about all the brands of trombones out there and mostly don't care either :idk:
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Re: The (occasional) joys of eBay gambling/buying blind

Post by SwissTbone »

Finetales wrote: Wed Sep 19, 2018 9:52 pm German eBay is also a great place to look.
German Ebay is cool if you look for very unique horns with some special custom modifications. But often horns are way overpriced.

But it is a good environnement for selling :-)
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Re: The (occasional) joys of eBay gambling/buying blind

Post by Kingfan »

shider wrote: Thu Sep 20, 2018 7:07 am
Finetales wrote: Wed Sep 19, 2018 9:52 pm German eBay is also a great place to look.
Yes, sometimes people here don't know much about the american brands, which results in different scenarios:
- an old, beat up King 606 or similar instrument for a shockingly high amount of money because the seller somewhere heard of the famous King instruments and how sought after they are..
- King 2b/3b/4b (and their derivatives) for cheap because the seller does't know what they are

But to get to pull the trigger on the second case one needs a LOT of patience..

PS: I chose King as an example, because they are readily available here, not as rare as the boutique custom horns and often played by amateurs who bought the only trombone the local music store (which might otherwise only trade in guitars and the like) had in the window and don't know about all the brands of trombones out there and mostly don't care either :idk:
Yep, picked up a nice 3B for $175, a 2B for $200, and a 3B+ for $200 all off local Craigslist. All were from the 90s, not the peak of King quality but still good players. I sold off all but the 2B after having them cleaned, de-dented, and the slides worked on. The advantage of Craigslist over eBay is I can look at the horns in person and walk away if not as advertised. eBay has some buyer protection, as does using PayPal, but still you never know until you get the horn delivered exactly what you bought.
I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are still missing! :D
Greg Songer
King 606, King 3B-F: DE LT101/LTD/D3
King 4B-F: Bach 5G Megatone gold plated
King 2107 bass: DE MB109/MB J/J8 King
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Re: The (occasional) joys of eBay gambling/buying blind

Post by SwissTbone »

Craigslist is not strong here in europe.
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Re: The (occasional) joys of eBay gambling/buying blind

Post by Kingfan »

cozzagiorgi wrote: Thu Sep 20, 2018 1:33 pm Craigslist is not strong here in europe.
Facebook Marketplace is another private sale site I haunt for bargains.
I'm not a complete idiot, some parts are still missing! :D
Greg Songer
King 606, King 3B-F: DE LT101/LTD/D3
King 4B-F: Bach 5G Megatone gold plated
King 2107 bass: DE MB109/MB J/J8 King
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Re: The (occasional) joys of eBay gambling/buying blind

Post by SwissTbone »

Me too, but it is a PITA to search in other regions.
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Re: The (occasional) joys of eBay gambling/buying blind

Post by Infiniticubed »

Hi Everyone. I just yesterday received my first trombone, and against the judgement of my wife, I bought it off of ebay.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Trombone-OLDS- ... true&rt=nc

It's a late 1950s Olds Ambassador trombone. I bought it so that I could learn to play the trombone along side my 8yr old son who chose trombone to learn for band. I played trumpet (also an Olds Ambassador from the 1970s) back in high school so I figured it wouldn't be too much of a stretch and it might work to keep him interested. He's super excited I bought one to play with him.

It came with the original case, in fair condition as well as a 1951 beginning band book, a 1951 college fight song book, and some random marching band sheet music of various ages.

I played around with it some and it sounds nice enough, no dings or dents, the bell is the appropriate shape, it's polished but not lacquered and the slide moves well. very little in the way of scratches and no discoloration at this point, though without the lacquer I imagine it's bound to happen. I payed $249 for it. I'm not sure if it's a good price, but it didn't seem unreasonable for the condition.

I don't believe the serial number on the slide matches the main instrument. The slide has serial number 345119 on it, but the main body has 706 written right where the slide attaches and also on the tuning slide. Is it normal for them to not seem to match?

It only let me post 3 pictures and I think the pictures are still visible on the ebay link.
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Re: The (occasional) joys of eBay gambling/buying blind

Post by Infiniticubed »

Here are the accessories received with it.
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Re: The (occasional) joys of eBay gambling/buying blind

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