First Bass Trombone

[Chronos91]

I've been playing trombone for about a year now, with my first trombone being a Getzen 747. I went by a music store that trades used instruments in town a couple weeks back and asked about how much their bass trombones were just out of curiosity. I didn't intend to get anything any time soon, but they had this and I was intrigued, especially for the price. I came back another time to try it, but all that was available for me to use as a mouthpiece was the Yamaha 48 I sometimes used for the Getzen. I decided I wanted to try it with an actual bass sized mouthpiece, and I went back when my Bach 2G showed up in the mail. Kind of like with my large tenor, I don't have anything to compare it to but I've been enjoying playing it and I think it will be good for exploring bass a bit. I'll probably play it exclusively for a month or so and then I'll try to work on both again.

The slide at least came from a YBL-322 but I have no idea with the bell/valve section, it's totally unmarked. It's in a dependent set up with the D valve being mounted on the tuning slide for the F attachment. If the YBL-322 came with an unmarked bell, then this was a modification along the way. There is one thing I'm a bit concerned about though. Is it normal for the double valve range to have an extremely different blow? As is, it's very different playing D and Db above the pedals on the F attachment rather than through both valves with the slide in D valve 1st or 2nd.



<Edit: Fixed image - BGuttman>

[BGuttman]

Looks like you found a horn with a slot-in 2nd valve. See if they have the conversion kit to make it a single as well.

The 2nd valve should add some more resistance, but you should have the alignment of the slot-in valve checked. If it's off it can make the blow harder.

Also, are you using correct positions? F-attachment positions are longer than Bb positions, and double valve positions are even longer. A properly tuned double valve Bb/F/D instrument should have low C below the staff in Bb 4th position (that's double trigger 3rd). Also, double trigger 2nd is further out than single trigger 2nd.

FWIW, my Yamaha 682 came with a bell just marked Yamaha (no model number). And a replacement bell could be completely unmarked.

Good luck.

[DougHulme]

There is no image appearing on my computer just the word 'image' from the OP?

[atopper333]

Congratulations on the first bass, just picked one up not too long ago and am enjoying it greatly!

Coincidentally, I did pick up a YBL-322. Mine is the same way, only marked with YBL-322 on the slide, no markings on the bell section.

I’m pretty certain they 322s only came as a single valve. The only thing I can think is that you either have a modified bell section, or a bell section from a double valve YBL-6XX with a 322 slide. Forgive me, I’m not that great at the model numbers for the older Yamaha basses.

I’m also unsure if there is a compatibility issue with the tenons between Yamaha basses…could be something to look at as well…

I’m sure getting that photo viewable will definitely give the more knowledgeable members here a good idea of what you have going on with it.

[BGuttman]

I fixed the image quote so it shows.

[spencercarran]

Is it normal for the double valve range to have an extremely different blow? As is, it's very different playing D and Db above the pedals on the F attachment rather than through both valves with the slide in D valve 1st or 2nd.

Yes, especially on these older instruments. You can get used to it with some practice, or you can spend more money for valves that respond more freely.

[Kdanielsen]

To answer your question: Yes, it’s very normal for the double valve notes to feel a bit stuffy.

[tbonesullivan]

There is one thing I'm a bit concerned about though. Is it normal for the double valve range to have an extremely different blow? As is, it's very different playing D and Db above the pedals on the F attachment rather than through both valves with the slide in D valve 1st or 2nd.

There may be air leaks and alignment issues not worked out with the horn, that can cause problems like this. Also just due to the nature of a "slot-in" valve, resonance can be a bit weird. Even on an independent bass, with both valves engaged you will have a different feeling blow and resonance character. On a dependent bass there is more of this.

That is a really interesting horn you've got there though.

[DougHulme]

I think that is a 322 all the way through with a custom added second valve. Theres probably a tech out there who could say 'I did that'! Yamaha never made such a modicification nor have they ever used those nylon bearings in the trigger, at least to my knowledge... as tbonesullivan says its a very interesting horn and looks in good condition too. You did well... Doug

[Chronos91]

I tried doing a quote thing on my phone but then it made me login again and I lost the stuff I added. I got a book called "New Method for the Modern Bass Trombone" that has great explanations on how the use of F attachment, E pull, flat E valve, Eb valve, D valve, and independent valve set ups all change the slide positions. I've also been practicing on the valves up an octave from where they're typically used to lock in on the positions in a register where the partials aren't as wide. I'll definitely have to check the alignment of the valve though and when I open the cap the D valve guides look like they're off a few degrees.

Besides the possible slight alignment issue on the valve though, the horn seems like it's in great condition. The slide feels great and the tuning feels good. At least in the range I can play (G1 to something around F4 scientific pitch notation, sometimes randomly higher) all of the partial tunings are fine. I'm working through some embouchure issues right now and I'm new anyway but it sounds good when I'm playing well.

[atopper333]

Now that looks like a really nice horn, would love to know where that work was done…been playing with the idea of getting a two valve bass, but don’t really want to give up my 322 as it has such a good sound.

That’s an awesome pickup and great find!