Lätzsch bass with dependent valves

[Nomsis]

I never had a bass trombone but am looking on and off for one for some time. Now I could get my hands on a gorgeous (in my uninformed opinion) Lätzsch bass trombone for probably less than 2000€. It is a rather old one, probably from the sixtys or seventys but in pretty good shape overall. The only thing I am concerned about right now is, there are two dependent valves and I am not sure whether this is worth the money nowadays. Also the slide could be a problem, I have not seen it yet. What do you guys think, is it worth the money for a starter or not? How much would it probably cost to change to an independent valve system?

PS: I can't find the search function right now, is it gone? Sorry if this topic is discussed here already.

[WGWTR180]

I never had a bass trombone but am looking on and off for one for some time. Now I could get my hands on a gorgeous (in my uninformed opinion) Lätzsch bass trombone for probably less than 2000€. It is a rather old one, probably from the sixtys or seventys but in pretty good shape overall. The only thing I am concerned about right now is, there are two independent valves and I am not sure whether this is worth the money nowadays. Also the slide could be a problem, I have not seen it yet. What do you guys think, is it worth the money for a starter or not? How much would it probably cost to change to an independent valve system?

PS: I can't find the search function right now, is it gone? Sorry if this topic is discussed here already.

If you don't get this I'd be interested in seeing some pics, If you have any. I play on dependent bass trombones. YES I'd say about 90% of the bass trombonists play on independent but if you like the way the instrument plays and you don't have to throw a lot of money into it then go for it. I probably wouldn't convert this instrument to an independent because: 1. You don't know how it will turn out. 2. After you pay someone to convert it you could have probably bought an independent instrument for the same $$$.

[Nomsis]

Thanks for the assessment, so dependent valves are not considered a deal breaker at this price point. I think I will have a closer look and try it out and then decide. I just "fear" a little needing to relearn later for independent valves if I might get one some day. But I guess it will not be to bad. I'm just a hobbyist after all At this point in live, this is the maximum budget I'm willing to spend for a trombone.

Is there something else considering the condition of the instrument one should look out for specifically?
I will share some pictures and send you the link if the instrument is then still available. If I buy it I will of course also share some pictures

[WGWTR180]

Thanks for the assessment, so dependent valves are not considered a deal breaker at this price point. I think I will have a closer look and try it out and then decide. I just "fear" a little needing to relearn later for independent valves if I might get one some day. But I guess it will not be to bad. I'm just a hobbyist after all At this point in live, this is the maximum budget I'm willing to spend for a trombone.

Is there something else considering the condition of the instrument one should look out for specifically?
I will share some pictures and send you the link if the instrument is then still available. If I buy it I will of course also share some pictures

By "deal breaker" if you mean resale difficulty then maybe a little bit. But of obtained at the right price you can always sell later. Learning later on an independent instrument should not be that difficult-I can switch back and forth if needed with no problems. You're only adding options with the second valve on an independent instrument-not relearning the entire instrument. Make sure the valve stems don't move around, make sure the inner slide plating is in tact and that the slide moves freely. check for major bell damage. Other than that play it and see what you think.

[musicofnote]

I played for around 20 years on a Bach50OG, independent valves and ... hated it. When I sold it, it went to a member of the Slokar Quartet who loved it. So it's not that it was a lemon. It just wasn't for me. I then bought a Yamaha Xeno 822g, dependent valves and love it. Does all the things I couldn't get the Bach to do. And I haven't run into a situation musically, that it wouldn't work. Yet. So if you're worried about dependent "being enough", that depends. Mine hs been more than enough for me, but your mileage may vary.

[hyperbolica]

The condition of the slide is the big issue. Condition of valves would be next. If you can put your hands on it and play it you can check that.

Independent valves are only an advantage if you plan to use the second valve by itself. Otherwise dependent have the advantage that you don't have to blow through both valves all the time.

Laetsch is an excellent maker, so there's at least a chance that a 50 year old horn could be a great one. We don't get many of them here in the US, but their reputation is excellent.

[Nomsis]

Thanks for all the feedback, I guess I need to take a closer look unfortunately I am a bit short of time right now but I guess one needs to pick possibilities when they come. I will definitely keep you informed.
The bell and valves look really good at least on the pictures, no real dents or so. But I will definitely check this before buying. The slide is described as workable but might not be perfect. I guess, if it might get necessary the slide could be replaced later relatively easy?
Funny enough it turned out I even played once with the owner some time ago (also he did not use this instrument). So this might help.

Any further feedback is very much appreciated though.

[Nomsis]

Sadly the trombone was sold now to another guy and I don't even have pictures to show, sorry!

[MrHCinDE]

Shame, sounded like an interesting horn but with a budget of about €2000 you should be able to find other options with a bit of patience, dependent for sure and maybe even independent.

With looking at used bass trombones, I put a bit more focus on mechanical condition than for tenor, just because it is mechanically more complicated and the valves get used a lot more. Slide action and sound are the other top factors for me. Since I‘m not playing complex bass trombone solo works, I don‘t place that much value on independent over dependent for dexterity as it doesn‘t really matter for what I‘m playing. I also found that some of the more affordable dependent options with classic rotors were a bit stuffier than similar independent options so there can also be advantage to independent, depends on the player and what they want to play!

[Nomsis]

I can't find much bass trombone stuff for 2000€ in my area and I don't want to buy crap. But it is no problem, I have time to wait for the next opportunity. So for the next time I just need to be faster (: Thanks to you guys I now should have a pretty good idea for what I need to look out.

[MrHCinDE]

I also found that some of the more affordable dependent options with classic rotors were a bit stuffier than similar independent options so there can also be advantage to independent, depends on the player and what they want to play!

Just realized my brainfart, this should read:
I also found that some of the more affordable independent options with classic rotors were a bit stuffier than similar dependent options so there can also be advantage to dependent, depends on the player and what they want to play!

Good luck in your search, patience is certainly useful!

[MrHCinDE]

Maybe this could be worth a look?

https://www.vanderglas.nl/bt2358-566765 ... 15-ventiel

It's a bit more than €2k but you never know, there could be some room for negotiation. There's a returns policy so you can't go too far wrong if it doesn’t work out for you or you try it and decide it isn't worth the money. Assuming you're in Europe, there's also no import tax to consider. I got a used bass from them last year which I'm very pleased with (there were a couple of teething problems but they were quickly resolved to my full satisfaction).

They have another couple of options around the €2k price point, one independent J.Monke and an Olds S23. I've got no idea how the J.Monke would play but on paper it sounds pretty interesting.