Bass Trombone Gb tuning??

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bassbonebuster
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Bass Trombone Gb tuning??

Post by bassbonebuster »

How do you independent basses tune your Gb? I've played Dependents for most of my career and would tune my F valve to low F with 2nd space C's a flat T1 and both valves to low D, but now I play an independent. Currently, I tune both valves to play low D in 1st and play my 2nd valve Gb's and D'bs in a flat 1st.
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elmsandr
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Re: Bass Trombone Gb tuning??

Post by elmsandr »

You'll find a nearly infinite number of options here. With a dependent, I usually have the F tuned fairly short, so that I have room to move it up a bit and put the D close to right on as I mostly use it for Db and lower. Taking that to independent, I try not to confuse myself, so I leave the F in the same place and tune the combined valves so that they are the same. This puts the Gb.. well, I don't really care WHERE that is, I almost never use Gb/Db in first. I know where the F/C are on the second valve and that works for me.

Read up on Bollinger tuning, many threads here, this is a High second valve (often requiring tubing to be cut) to put a lot of things down the slide in a better place.

If I didn't have to go back and forth between an indy and a dependent horn, I am not sure I would do it the way I do. I would probably put the shorter valve as high as i could (I really like G attachments) and put the longer valve lower to get separation between them to give me a more 'mathematically optimal' number of choices. For some reason Bb/G/bE/D tuning isn't very popular, however.

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Re: Bass Trombone Gb tuning??

Post by GabrielRice »

bassbonebuster wrote: Thu Apr 21, 2022 7:53 am How do you independent basses tune your Gb? I've played Dependents for most of my career and would tune my F valve to low F with 2nd space C's a flat T1 and both valves to low D, but now I play an independent. Currently, I tune both valves to play low D in 1st and play my 2nd valve Gb's and D'bs in a flat 1st.
That's how I do it.
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hyperbolica
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Re: Bass Trombone Gb tuning??

Post by hyperbolica »

I tune 1st valve to F, and that puts C about 1" out. 1st and 2nd together I tune to D, so that puts Db/Gb in very flat first, about 3" out. There's a big benefit to learning how to use the second trigger independently. It requires a bit of dexterity, but a huge advantage when you get into 4 or more flats or 2 sharps in a key signature. You get a lot of 5th position notes up close.

I used to have a dependent bass bone, and I tuned 2nd valve to Eb, but D is just as good.

There are other philosophies. I used to subscribe to the Bollinger that Andy mentions, but I've switched to Bb/F/#Gb/D. I don't like calling out flat notes in 1st position, they're useless. The first note you can play on the second valve is Gb, and it's pretty far out if 1&2 D is in tune.

A lot of older dependent horns just come with an E valve, which is only meant to be used to extend the slide enough for low C and B.

I also used to have a single valve instrument and had an Eb extension made for it. That requires that you use a lot of 6th and 7th position, and gets kind of hairy when you have to go back and forth between B nat and Bb or E and Eb.

Each system has advantages and disadvantages, you gotta find what you like best, but the indy Bb/F/#Gb/D is the most common. Especially with new horns, it's hard to find them tuned any other way.
ChadA
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Re: Bass Trombone Gb tuning??

Post by ChadA »

I'm an outlier. I tune my Gb valve a little flat, so an F major arpeggio lines up in 2nd position with the F and C both using the Gb valve and the A open. The Bollinger tuning is a similar idea (tuning an arpeggio), but his is a Db major arpeggio that lines up in 3rd, I believe.

Tuning the valves so your Bb arpeggio lines up in 1st (Bb open, F in the f valve, D with combined valves) is a great place to start.
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Finetales
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Re: Bass Trombone Gb tuning??

Post by Finetales »

I've always left my Gb all the way in. I like having the Gb positions a little out.
tbonesullivan
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Re: Bass Trombone Gb tuning??

Post by tbonesullivan »

Many great ideas already presented here. For me, I want the low D in tune, and the F in T1 in tune. The Gb is tuned to make that happen. I tune the F attachment on all of my trombones the same, both tenor and bass. I have found that is easiest for my brain to handle.
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robcat2075
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Re: Bass Trombone Gb tuning??

Post by robcat2075 »

Perhaps you're already aware of it but there is a bass trombone method book by Eliezer Aharoni, unsurprisingly titled "The New Method for Modern Bass Trombone by Eliezer Aharoni", which, aside from the usual material for players who have never previously even had one valve, has a section that covers just about every useful tuning of both dependent and independent valves, along with musical material to exercise you on their individual nuances.

You could become proficient on all and never need to decide on one!

The downside of this book is the atrociously stiff binding which makes it nearly impossible to keep open on a music stand.

Plan on converting it to a spiral or 3-ring

It seems to be unavailable on Amazon but retailers still offer it.
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hyperbolica
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Re: Bass Trombone Gb tuning??

Post by hyperbolica »

I got one of these for Christmas, and it makes stiff bindings easier to deal with. There are other devices out there for holding books open.

Image

Also, I'd like to mention another book by Aharoni, the Non-Classic Trombonist. It has a lot of text and image type information around bass bone equipment and non-classical styles of playing, along with some examples. This has been one of my favorite texts. I wish more tbone books were written this way.

Also, since I'm here, Blair Bollinger was mentioned. He also has a book that describes his method. Valve Technique for Bass Trombone or You've Got TWO valves - use BOTH. Obviously for independent bass players.
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Re: Bass Trombone Gb tuning??

Post by whitbey »

My Bass Bach 50 was bought in the 70’s from Giardinelli in New York. The sales guy I worked with said the horn was originally a single valve Mount Vernon horn that Giardinelli sent to Bach to add a second valve. He said it had been in their store for years before they sent it back. There was a solder mark in the receiver. The same guy told me that was where the original lever was. With the new valve the new style twin keys were put on the bell brace. The bell was stamped Elkhorn and Corporation at that time on an angle to the original engraving. There is no serial number; it was lost when the horn was reassembled. A solder joint let go in the mid 80’s and my tech reassembled the bell section. Before this the horn was really good, after reassembly it was incredible. I think Bach variations in their quality of assembly shows. The bell is very soft and thin and plays like a dream. The second valve was set up as a dependent Bb/F/E. I had a new tuning slide made with larger tubing in C so now the horn is Bb/F/C. Low C with both valves is in first position and plays very open. Peddle BBb is in a long 3rd and plays easy too. Low B in two trigger long 2nd position is an easy hit. So in the key of C and the sharp keys the horn is easy to play as the positions are close to the same as with the F valve for C, B, Bb, and A.
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trombonedemon
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Re: Bass Trombone Gb tuning??

Post by trombonedemon »

I don't. All my slides are pushed in. Never had to pull out "Giggety" on this horn. Only Bass I've ever played consistently. I was flat the first on the horn. .5 mm ago. Embouchure strengthened , never looked "Bach."
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