Jay Friedman Bach 45

[hornbuilder]

Had the pleasure of hearing the activation Stmphony Brass last night. Jay is infact playing a Bach 45. And sounding stunningly good.

What a marvelous concert. If you ever have the chance to attend. Do it.

[Crazy4Tbone86]

Since he has played a nickel .562 slide for so long, I imagine he is still playing a bass slide?!?

[slipmo]

He's playing a stock Mt Vernon 45B 9" yellow bell (that I restored for him last year) with his nickel LW 50 slide and our Reeves-Ark JF mouthpiece with a MV50 copper seamed leadpipe.

[elmsandr]

See! I'm not the only one that loves the Bach 45!! (Though Jay may be the only person that actually makes it work).

Cheers,
Andy

[ithinknot]

Noice. Been playing around with a TR156 this week

[Tbarh]

He's playing a stock Mt Vernon 45B 9" yellow bell (that I restored for him last year) with his nickel LW 50 slide and our Reeves-Ark JF mouthpiece with a MV50 copper seamed leadpipe.

Original Valve section and Tuning slide?

[octavposaune]

Tbarh, yes Jays bell section is original. I visited him this summer and showed him my modern 45 (before Delta was around).

My 45 flair is mount on a chassis loosely based on the A47 chassis and some 42 parts. The valve bore is not correct for original 45s, nor is the smaller span tuning slide.

Jays 45 is pretty amazing and has some quirks that make it more suitable for tenor use. There are 45s that are more bass like. The brassark MV50 leadpipe also has a narrow throat which helps focus on such a horn.

Benn

[Tbarh]

Tbarh, yes Jays bell section is original. I visited him this summer and showed him my modern 45 (before Delta was around).

My 45 flair is mount on a chassis loosely based on the A47 chassis and some 42 parts. The valve bore is not correct for original 45s, nor is the smaller span tuning slide.

Jays 45 is pretty amazing and has some quirks that make it more suitable for tenor use. There are 45s that are more bass like. The brassark MV50 leadpipe also has a narrow throat which helps focus on such a horn.

Benn

COOL!.. Thanks!
I have only seen a Bach 45B once (NewYork, 9.5")..cant remember the difference in Bell taper.. How does the Bell taper compare to a 88HK or a King 5B?

Trond

[elmsandr]

Tbarh, yes Jays bell section is original. I visited him this summer and showed him my modern 45 (before Delta was around).

My 45 flair is mount on a chassis loosely based on the A47 chassis and some 42 parts. The valve bore is not correct for original 45s, nor is the smaller span tuning slide.

Jays 45 is pretty amazing and has some quirks that make it more suitable for tenor use. There are 45s that are more bass like. The brassark MV50 leadpipe also has a narrow throat which helps focus on such a horn.

Benn

COOL!.. Thanks!
I have only seen a Bach 45B once (NewYork, 9.5")..cant remember the difference in Bell taper.. How does the Bell taper compare to a 88HK or a King 5B?

Trond

Vaguely similar. I haven't had mine immediately adjacent to either the 5B or the K flare to compare exactly. It is distinctly larger than a tenor flare, but tighter than even the 'small' 70H throat.

For other interesting points, according to the shop cards, my two 45s have different tuning slides.

Cheers,
Andy

[Tbarh]

My 1920 Conn "Symphony Large" (8H) has a much bigger Bell taper than the later models 8H/88H.. Also much bigger than the 42B.. Wonder how close this one is to a 45B..the rest of the Horn are similar to a Modern 8/88H..

[BrianJohnston]

My 1920 Conn "Symphony Large" (8H) has a much bigger Bell taper than the later models 8H/88H.. Also much bigger than the 42B.. Wonder how close this one is to a 45B..the rest of the Horn are similar to a Modern 8/88H..

Maybe a bigger taper?, but I believe the bell is only an 8.

To follow up on the thread about Jay, He plays a 45 bell, bass trombone slide, and pretty large mouthpiece, yet can still play high notes better than all of us... oh yeah and he's in his mid 80s.

[modelerdc]

I once owned a Mt Vernon 45. The slide was identical in all respects to a 42 slide, only the 45 stamping on it was different. The valve section was the same as a Mt Vernon 50B I had. The Tuning slide was smaller than the 50 but larger than the 42. I really didn't like the way the 45B I had played, I thought it was neither fish nor fowl and sold it. It's interesting to note that when the Mt. Vernons 45Bs were made, they were sold as bass trombones, not as large tenors. I guess they have had a similar evolution to the King Symphony bass, model 1480 and 1485. This horn with a 9-inch bell was originally sold as a bass trombone. It was sometimes use as a large tenor. I used to have a 1480, and it had a .536 bore slide, but like the Bach 45B the tuning slide was larger than the later large bore tenor based 5B, which had the slide, valve, tuning slide from the 4B but the bell from the 1480 to become a sort of large tenor.
I'm glad that someone can make use of these small basses or super large tenors, but for my money they are essentially obsolete as bass trombones.

[Pezza]

I would love a Bach 45. I guess I'll have to make do with my King 5B!
I had a Bach 50, but after several injuries it wasn't working for me. The King 5B works as a bass, with a Bach 36 or 12 as my tenor.

[Tbarh]

My 1920 Conn "Symphony Large" (8H) has a much bigger Bell taper than the later models 8H/88H.. Also much bigger than the 42B.. Wonder how close this one is to a 45B..the rest of the Horn are similar to a Modern 8/88H..

Maybe a bigger taper?, but I believe the bell is only an 8.

To follow up on the thread about Jay, He plays a 45 bell, bass trombone slide, and pretty large mouthpiece, yet can still play high notes better than all of us... oh yeah and he's in his mid 80s.

No, the bell is 8 1/2"..i know they also came with 8"... Early 45B also came with 9 1/2"

[EOlson9]

I would love something along the lines of a 45B, 5B, or 88HK, with carbon fiber bell and outer slide, dual bore. It would be a nice lightweight smallish bass, especially for pit orchestra, concert/jazz band, and even trombone choir. Maybe Dave Butler would build me a 9" bell someday.

[Matt K]

I recently picked up an 88HK for Shires tenors. I'm toying with the idea of swapping the receiver on it for a bass tuning slide. I have a 2RVET7 that seems to work better for me for anything I'd use a tenor for but a little extra focus might be really nice on bass. Not sure if the receiver would work right though.

[EOlson9]

I recently picked up an 88HK for Shires tenors. I'm toying with the idea of swapping the receiver on it for a bass tuning slide. I have a 2RVET7 that seems to work better for me for anything I'd use a tenor for but a little extra focus might be really nice on bass. Not sure if the receiver would work right though.

I would be interested in hearing your thoughts on that if you do go that route!

[drbucher]

So, when Jay said the Holton 156 was "based on the things I like about old Bach horns" (email to me in March 2011), he probably meant the Bach 45, which I saw him with in an October 2022 CSO video.

[Burgerbob]

So, when Jay said the Holton 156 was "based on the things I like about old Bach horns" (email to me in March 2011), he probably meant the Bach 45, which I saw him with in an October 2022 CSO video.

I'm not sure about that. You'd have to ask him if he had a 45 when the Holton was being designed.