Cheap Euphonium Shootout

[hyperbolica]

Aging after a wild and reckless youth is a terrible thing. I had a big bicycle accident in my early 30s, and it compressed a couple of disks in my neck. Over time it led to numbness and eventually pain in my arms. I have a lot of strength, but very little endurance, and some positions are impossible. Trombones, especially basses, are really hard for me to hold for very long. 3 Easters ago I had a gig playing bass where I wound up sweating profusely because of the pain caused by just playing a single tune (4-5 minutes). I've since had a steroid injection which improved things for a while, but holding the horn is still tough. I use Get A Grip and Ergobone, which help, but don't eliminate the problem.

So I'm playing more valves these days. A lot of bone players double on something with valves for tuba Christmas or tuba quartets or just for the added opportunity or challenge. So I thought I'd review some of my experiences with valve instruments.

I've owned a few valve horns (not including tubas):
- Wessex Dolce (traditional 3+1 compensating)
- Wessex Festivo (4v-in-front compensating)
- King 2280 (4v-on-top non-compensating)
- Conn 24i (4vin-front non-compensating)
- Olds/Bach Compact Marching Trombone (3v flugabone type horn)

Wessex Dolce is a pretty traditional British style 3+1 compensator, and it feels, plays and sounds like that. The tuning was pretty good, but as a trombone player, valve tuning is something you have to get used to, using valve combos, slides, lip, and "eyebrow English" to get things to line up. It was a pretty standard instrument, maybe requires more care of cleaning of the valves than other instruments. Getting used to the sound over your head is the first thing a trombone player notices, also how nebulous the sound can be (some call that dark). For me, the 3+1 holding posture was like throwing a baseball and getting something out of your right pocket with the left hand at the same time. Ergonomically for me, it just wasn't going to work. So I sold this one. (.59 bore, 12" bell, ~$1500)

Wessex Festivo is less traditional. It's still a 4v compensator, but all the valves are played by the right hand like a front valve tuba, and you hold it kind of like cradling a baby. The valves on Festivo are a little quieter than the Dolce, and ergonomically it's just about perfect - arms down low in front, not contorted around. The sound is a little brighter with more clarity than the Dolce. Valves also need cleaning I think just part of the Wessex process leaves junk in the horn that comes out over time. It's really nice to play, although I like a brighter sound still. This horn is very easy to use with a range of mouthpieces. I've played from 5G size to 1 1/4G size on it, with varying levels of success. I've found the Wick SM3/SM3U are right in the sweet spot this horn.

It is interesting to me how ingrained certain conventions can be. One thing that concerns euph and tuba players is which direction the bell goes. The Dolce leans to the player's right while the Festivo leans to the player's left. This might mean more to you personally if you have a good or bad eye, or if you sit on the left or right while sharing a stand with another player. Sometimes the concern is bells pointing at one another and sound problems that might create or visual problems in a row of dissimilar instruments. [sarcasm]You know how we all love uniformity.[/sarcasm]
(.59 bore, 11" bell, ~$1600)

King 2280 is even less traditional. I think "real" euphonium players tend to scoff at this model because it isn't a real compensator, although it has a lot of flexibility especially for tuning. It is similar to the Conn 19i. It has 4 top valves with an optional Eb pull on the 4th valve. That's like putting an Eb slide on a trombone trigger. By default it uses the traditional F tuning, but you can use F, E, bE or Eb tuning. Plus in it's complete configuration, it has a sprung trigger for the 3rd valve (which tends to get lost somehow on used horns). Horn Guys has a huge article on this model based on its tuning and other characteristics https://www.hornguys.com/products/king- ... -euphonium. Out-of-the-box tuning is very good. And the valves are good. Conn-Selmer still sell this horn new, so it's easy to get replacement and mod parts for it. And it's relatively very cheap compared to "real" euphoniums.

For me, the 2280 is easier to play, meaning that even low levels of sound speak more easily than with the Wessex horns. I tend to get a lot of false attacks or air balls with the bigger horns that don't happen with the 2280. It seems to give more subtle control over volume and sound in general.

The 2280 sounds a little brighter/clearer than the traditional instruments. I think it's nickname is the "Soloist", and that makes sense, as solos would seem to be its strong point over section blending. It has an absolutely raucous low range (which to me means it's loud and powerful). I have a hard time playing pedal G on a bass bone, but I can reliably play pedal C on the 2280 with the SM3U.

One quirk is that the receiver is slightly larger than the typical large shank trombone mouthpiece. Not sure if the mouthpiece it comes with fits, but everything I had required a couple layers of teflon tape to keep it from bottoming out on the receiver. Overall, great horn, fantastic sound, very resonant, great low range, and wildly flexible. The only down side to the 2280 for me is the awkward right hand position. (.58 bore, 11"bell, ~$3000)

Conn 24i Connstellation is a horn I've long wanted to play against these others, and just recently acquired. It is much brighter than the traditional British euphoniums, so much so that you might even be excused for calling it a Baritone. It also takes much less air. Small bore trombone players might like this horn better than the bigger euphs. 562 sounds like a big bore, but for valved instruments with all those obstructions to the air, they need a larger bore than an equivalent tbone. I got the 24i configuration, which is the bell forward instrument. The 25i is a bell up horn. Both are removable bells.

The 24i has a smaller bore (562) than the 2280 (580) and the receiver is smaller than any of my DE small shank mouthpieces would comfortably fit. What is it about American euphonium mouthpiece receivers? For the time being, I'm using a DE XT F4, although I'm trying to get something else that fits it better. This arrangement feels a bit tight (not to say stuffy), but the sound is really perfect, and the more I play it the more I like it.

To me, this is the sound that a baritone is supposed to have. It's lighter, clearer, still plays well down into the pedals, and the overall horn is physically lighter, even with the removable bell. It's maybe not as resonant as the 2280, but much less woofy than the traditional euphs. The ergonomics are not as perfect as the Festivo, but an adjustment to the leadpipe might fix that.

Where does a 24i fit? Some people might cynically say it fits in the 1960's, when it was made. I don't think they'd kick you out of most community bands if it were all you had, but a serious brass band would surely want you to play something else. It won't match the sound of a section of traditional Brit euphs. But for playing at home, it's great. It will also get a trombone player into Tuba Christmas. Great for Christmas caroling. Maybe you can play it in the church band. Dixieland band? I'd say yes. Outdoor band concerts or marching band? Definitely. Just don't take it anywhere where you're going to run into those people who are going to look down their noses at you. You'll sound great, but they'll all be looking at all those dents and how much lacquer you're missing, and WHAT? NO SILVER PLATE?

Two other intonation comments. 24i has a spring on the main tuning slide and a ring like a trumpet 3rd valve slide, which to me makes more sense than the 2280s sprung 3rd valve slide because it allows you to tune any note, whether it uses the 3rd valve or not. And it seems to be very mouthpiece dependent. Big mouthpieces seem to flatten the lower partials. I've read reports of people using 6 1/2AL with this. That's close to the size I've been using (DE XT F4).

Olds/Bach Compact Marching Trombone is a lot of fun to play. I've had 2 of these, you can sometimes find them cheap. Like under $200 kind of cheap. It's not a very ergonomic instrument, and it's not crazy in-tune with itself, but it's fun instrument to play standards and just noodle on. I kept one of these around the office and would toot whenever the mood struck me. Plus, it fit in my luggage, so it always went on trips with me. And at $200, you're not going to worry much about a scratch or a dent. Typically I think these were around .510 bore and take a small shank mouthpiece. Definitely another small bore trombonist instrument.

So anyway, maybe this summary helps you pick out valves to go along with your slide. Learning about which horn to select requires that you play a lot of horns, which is at least time consuming, and can be expensive, if you can find the horns at all. So if you're not really a traditional Brit euphonium or brass band sort of person, maybe give one of these alternative horns a try. They can be a lot of fun.

If you can't tell, my favorite moves back and forth between the 24i and the 2280, although I do love the ergonomics of the Festivo.

[Gasche88]

This is a wonderful and very helpful read! I own a Boosey and Hawkes Imperial from 1965, and in comparison to most other euphoniums I've played, it has been my favorite. As a doubler, some might call it a bit "much" for me, as it's my secondary instrument, however I think it was a smart purchase. Playing in wind ensembles I find it blends well and lends itself very good to that classically and characteristically dark sound you might be wanting.

For myself, I'm a very bright player on trombone, and I found myself in the same dilemma with euphonium so I initially purchased a Chinese branded Euphonium from Andalucia called the Concerto II. It had a Satin brushed lacquer finish and was essentially a copy of the Yamaha YEP642/864. It was a good horn sure, the upper register sung very nicely at times, but it ended up being far too dark, and just ended up being awfully muddy, especially in the lower register.

The Imperial, however, seemed to satisfy my needs because of two aspects, the silver plating and the medium bore. I figured based on my previous experiences with American euphoniums, which I've played both small and large bore variants, I felt the large bores tended to be too thin in the upper register, and the small bore was too tinny in the lower register. Subsequently I felt they both tended to be either too dark or too bright for what I wanted. With the Imperial, it was a perfect blend of both bore sizes, naturally being medium bore, along with the silver plating, it managed to be the perfect balance of bright and dark, and likewise very controllable.

The only drawback was finding a decent mouthpiece to pair it with, considering the rarity of medium bore mouthpieces in your everyday music store plus the instrument being in Low-Pitch. It came with a Denis Wick 4AM, which was the recommended mouthpiece according to their website for these particular horns. After a few months of playing on it, I just wasn't in love with the feel of it, so that's what drew me to looking into an alternative piece. Being located in the center of the United States, I had a hard time sourcing mouthpieces to test out, and had to ask for other players to entrust me with their gear in order to do so. Finally, I managed to land on a Hammond 12L that had been converted to medium shank and it has so far been my saving grace.

I gave around $2100 for the horn, and I've not had a single complaint about it aside from the mouthpiece issue.

[stewbones43]

Can I suggest another model to add to your list?

Check out the John Packer JP 374 and JP 374T models. These are top quality Chinese models with design input from Paul Riggett of Sterling Instruments and are both fully compensating and available in clear lacquer or bright silver plate. They come complete with a mouthpiece and fitted case and also are supplied with a maintenance kit.

https://www.johnpacker.co.uk/shop/brass ... ium/page/2

Cheers

Stewbones43

[Kbiggs]

Hyperbolica, have you tried the ergobrass for euphonium?

https://www.ergobrass.com/euphonium/

That might be a way to continue playing euph with your shoulder problems.

[hyperbolica]

Hyperbolica, have you tried the ergobrass for euphonium?

https://www.ergobrass.com/euphonium/

That might be a way to continue playing euph with your shoulder problems.

I have ergobone for trombone , and could probably adapt the bits I don't use for euph.

The Festivo is perfect, ergonomically speaking. So I always have something I can play. It has some other issues, but ergonomics is not one of them.
The 2280 twists your wrist in a funny way right at the end, especially when you use your pinky. I'm not sure ergobrass could fix that unless I can find another way to hold it (change the rotation of the instrument.)
The Conn leadpipe is just wrapped too tight (main bow runs into my gut), and I can't really get a proper embouchure on it, and both the 2280 and Conn have mouthpiece fit problems.
Maybe an ergobrass with the flugabone would be cool. I mean, I'd still look like a dork, as usual, but it might be helpful.

Can I suggest another model to add to your list?

Check out the John Packer JP 374 and JP 374T models. These are top quality Chinese models with design input from Paul Riggett of Sterling Instruments and are both fully compensating and available in clear lacquer or bright silver plate. They come complete with a mouthpiece and fitted case and also are supplied with a maintenance kit.

https://www.johnpacker.co.uk/shop/brass ... ium/page/2

Cheers

Stewbones43

Yeah, I've heard good things about the JP. I kind of hope to be done researching valves, but yeah, others are welcome to add to the list of other people on "the quest" to try out.

[Finetales]

I wonder how you'd feel about the Wessex tornister euph (with an ergobone presumably, since it's far too small to rest on the leg). The extra-small bell and bore give it a nice bright, compact sound. I'd also be curious how you liked a German Kaiser baritone (which Wessex also makes). The tone and ergonomics of that might be just what you're after.

[Matt K]

I'm quite bias because I'm selling a 2280 right now but it's definitely been my favorite euph that I've owned. I do have a preference for the pro Wilson that I was borrowing for gigs when I had them with the Utah Wind Symphony but it was also like 10k cheaper!

[hyperbolica]

I wonder how you'd feel about the Wessex tornister euph (with an ergobone presumably, since it's far too small to rest on the leg). The extra-small bell and bore give it a nice bright, compact sound. I'd also be curious how you liked a German Kaiser baritone (which Wessex also makes). The tone and ergonomics of that might be just what you're after.

I keep looking for wacky stuff, but my play money pile isn't as big as it used to be.

- Miraphone 50a - rotary valve euph/tenor tuba
- Bubbie 5 - mini F tuba

I'd love to play some of the other wacky Wessex designs, but I need to wait for the DC Army tuba conference to come around again. I think the tornister tuba BBb seems well regarded.

Ideally, I'd like the layout of the Festivo with the tuning capabilities and low range of the 2280 and the lighter sound of the 24i. I might be the only one who liked it, though.

I've also thought about getting one of those Neotech harnesses that could be used for any valve instrument.

[Finetales]

The Wessex tornister tubas are alright, but I was far more impressed by the ZO travel tubas they had at NAMM. They played awesome.

[hyperbolica]

The Wessex tornister tubas are alright, but I was far more impressed by the ZO travel tubas they had at NAMM. They played awesome.

The funky radiator-looking ones? Those look like fun!

zoradiator.jpg

[Finetales]

That's the one!

[JasonDonnelly]

The Wessex tornister euph was definitely my favorite of their instruments that I've tried. If I played in a polka or dixieland group I might snag one of those.

Anytime I advise someone on purchasing a euph, I tell them that if they don't want or can't afford a compensator from one of the big names, just get a Yamaha 321. They are super reliable, cheap, and will do basically anything you want a euph to do. Large-shank adapters are also available if that's an issue. If I lived in NYC or somewhere else where outdoor brass band gigs were a thing, I'd pick one up in a heartbeat.

[davebb]

Yamaha 321 has a lot of good reviews. I bought an old 3 valve yep201 which is the student model below the 321. It was fine while my son was a beginner, but the tuning isn’t great and eventually neither of us wanted to play it for that reason. I think it is easily worth paying twice as much for a 321 than a 201.

[Kbiggs]

The ErgoBrass kit for euph is quite different than that for trombone. A metal plate that has a hole in the back is attached to the tubing around the valve cluster. The support rod is then inserted into the back of the plate. I don’t own a euph (yet!), but I tried a Yamaha 6xx with the ErgoBrass, and found it more comfortable than the ErgoBone.