There has been an ongoing thread recently on the pedagogy section about shifts, etc. called High Range Pedagogy. (
For example, I have always remarked on how most of the time J.J.'s magnificent sound tailed off most of the time around
Search
- Thu Nov 20, 2008 5:33 am
- Forum: TTF Archives / TTF Archives / Creation and Performance / Trombonists
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More YouTube Trombonists - Replies: 2499
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There has been an ongoing thread recently on the pedagogy section about shifts, etc. called High Range Pedagogy. (
For example, I have always remarked on how most of the time J.J.'s magnificent sound tailed off most of the time around
- Fri Nov 14, 2008 8:50 am
- Forum: TTF Archives / TTF Archives / Creation and Performance / Trombonists
- Topic:
More YouTube Trombonists - Replies: 2499
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Both are really only about one thing, but it is hard to name that one thing.
I'll give it a try, though. A number of tries.
Republicans and Democrats.
Conservatives and liberals.
The old and the new.
The safe and the risky.
And, to blow all of the above away...the essential falsehood of two-dimensional thought.
Either/or does not cut it here. Any good boxer, martial artist or baseball player understands this on a physical level.
Y'got yer boxers, y'got yer punchers and y'got yer boxer/punchers. It is the third dimension that cops the ultimate prize.
The great ones?
I do not care if it is Muhammad Ali, J. J. Johnson, Gary Valente, Hank Aaron, Urbie Green, Carmine Basilio, Larry Bird, Tiger Woods or Jascha Heifetz...they play with power AND finesse.
Now I know for a continuing fact that when Gary wishes to…
- Thu Nov 13, 2008 11:15 am
- Forum: TTF Archives / TTF Archives / Creation and Performance / Trombonists
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You guys are kidding about Valente, right? The sound on the UTube video? Personally, I don't like his sound at all. No, actually, I think it sucks, to be more accurate. I find it irritatingly blatty and with an overblown kazoo edge that might work in fusion (also not my cup-o-tea) or salsa, but is totally inappropriate for jazz.
It all depends on your definition of "jazz", I guess.
Or maybe of music in general.
And it also depends to some degree on your understanding of the limitations of recording and playback, especially on digital garbage heaps like YouTube. Those of us us who have heard Gary in the flesh understand that his sound is almost unrecordable, and no doubt we are filling in this cartoon of his sound with all of the colors that we know are there from personal experience.
There were those...many of them..who had similarly negative visceral reactions to Louis Armstrong's trumpet…
- Sun Oct 26, 2008 4:53 am
- Forum: TTF Archives / TTF Archives / Creation and Performance / Trombonists
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Andrew
Only in a culture this devolved, this decayed could someone who can do what Gary has done on a consistent basis for about 30 years have not been heard at least by all of those who play his instrument.
By more, really, because he transcends "instrument" the way James Brown or Frank Sinatra transcend "singing".
Deep.
Later...
S.
- Sun Oct 26, 2008 2:11 am
- Forum: TTF Archives / TTF Archives / Creation and Performance / Trombonists
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There is more than one way to skin a cat.
POWER!!!
And soul.
The Preacher preaches.
Do I hear an amen?
I should.
Awesome.
A prodigy of nature.
Awesome.
S.
- Wed Aug 20, 2008 9:07 pm
- Forum: TTF Archives / TTF Archives / Creation and Performance / Trombonists
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great chart & conception also-I always appreciate the sound of trombone honing in Coltrane's sphere in this way, it is a natural fit. Awesome, Sam.
j
Thank you, Josh.
Someday, maybe I'll be able to record the other many hours of music that I have finished and waiting in the depths of my computer. Money is a *****, ain't it?
But as Duke said...
Quote
There is hardly any money interest in art, and music will be there when money is gone.
Yup.
So it goes.
I am glad you liked it. 'Trane changed my life.
S.
- Tue Aug 05, 2008 5:16 am
- Forum: TTF Archives / TTF Archives / Creation and Performance / Trombonists
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-ben
And...as I have been saying, they are amazing axes. I have 4 now. The best one...for me, for semi-practical use in some situations...is a dual bore that appears to be around .500/.515.
Damn they play well!!!
S.
- Tue Aug 05, 2008 5:13 am
- Forum: TTF Archives / TTF Archives / Creation and Performance / Trombonists
- Topic:
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Great playing! Does his trombone have TIS?
YIS.
S.
- Fri Jun 27, 2008 8:33 am
- Forum: TTF Archives / TTF Archives / Creation and Performance / Trombonists
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You're kidding.
Right?
Two reasons...just in case you're not kidding.
1-The danger of being injured by alla those blasting tubas, euphs and what ever the hell else they were using to do the Busby Berkeley thing. Deafening, even on my computer speakers.
2-Equally deafening...? The amplification on Harry's solo.
3-Potentially life-threatening corn allergies.
I mean...when Gene Krupa played those drum solos, he made something /happen!!! And the Goodman band was swinging its collective ASS off. 16 or so world-class jazz players.
A 50+ member wind ensemble?
I don't THINK so.
And then there was Benny Goodman.
No slouch either, if y'know what I mean.
Plus...it was new then. The chart, the idiom, the music. Alive.
Now it's more like corn-fed canned ham. The kind that has lots of preservatives.
I understand that Harry is just…
- Wed Nov 28, 2007 3:30 pm
- Forum: TTF Archives / TTF Archives / Creation and Performance / Trombonists
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Listen to Quentin "Butter" Jackson around the 3:22 mark and beyond! Great plunger work!
While you're at it...CHECK OUT JIMMY HAMILTON!!!
Talk about AIR!!!
I got yer lesson.. right here!!!
And also Lawrence Brown a few bars before Butter starts to play.
Lord!
What a blessing that band was.
S.
- Mon Nov 12, 2007 7:18 am
- Forum: TTF Archives / TTF Archives / Creation and Performance / Trombonists
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---snip---
I'm more and more convinced that great time as exhibited in this clip is a cultural gift. You got it or you ain't.
I think that it is more experiential than cultural, Jerry.
And NOT a "gift". It must be earned.
Sure, it's easier to earn it if you grow up hearing Basie from the cradle.
But...how do we explain Niels-Henning Ørsted Pedersen or Valery Pomonarev or Barry Rogers or any OTHER people who master time feels on that level without the benefit of growing up in the cultures that produced them?
S.
- Mon Nov 12, 2007 5:32 am
- Forum: TTF Archives / TTF Archives / Creation and Performance / Trombonists
- Topic:
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Great trombonists, great band! This is what a big band should sound like!
Time.
Time time time time time time time time time time time time time time.
Jo Jones!!!
Basie!!!
Freddie Green!!!
O my Lord!!!
Time time time time time time time time time time time time time time.
Why did these people play so well?
How could you NOT play well with time like that going on?
Jimmy Rushing (The heavy-set man who is not playing...ever listen to HIM sing?) has better time just STANDING THERE than do most musicians today in full swing.
And a special heads up for the first trumpet soloist...my second or third father in many respects, the great Joe Wilder. Still playing, touring and teaching today, in his '80s. This is the man who essentially broke the…
- Wed Aug 01, 2007 12:18 pm
- Forum: TTF Archives / TTF Archives / Creation and Performance / Trombonists
- Topic:
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weird
FINALLY!!!
Some real trombone stuff.
S.
- Sat Feb 24, 2007 6:31 pm
- Forum: TTF Archives / TTF Archives / Creation and Performance / Trombonists
- Topic:
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Thanks TWICE for posting that.
It enabled me to find a long-lost friend as well.
Cleve Pozar.
What a monster HE is!!!
Later...
S.
- Sat Feb 24, 2007 6:29 pm
- Forum: TTF Archives / TTF Archives / Creation and Performance / Trombonists
- Topic:
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Send a copy to the idiot on the TrbL who keeps bugging you about the live recording from the ITA thang.
Naaahhhh... he wouldn't get it. He's just a front for somebody else with a grudge, anyway...
A gofer troll.
QuoteThanks for all you do for trombone.
Off topic, sorry. Great playing, Mr. Burtis.
Truth?
It's what the trombone...and music...has done for ME.
Really.
I'm just trying to pay a little back.
I'll never manage to pay off the debt.
It's all I can do to keep up with the vig.
Later...
S.
- Sat Feb 24, 2007 4:44 pm
- Forum: TTF Archives / TTF Archives / Creation and Performance / Trombonists
- Topic:
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Really dug the playing on Naima and the chart...
The character flaw lay in whatever sadist gave me a tuba to play in 3rd grade. I lugged that damned thing home a hundred times. I swear to God...in its hard case, it weighed more than I did.
After that...it's been all uphill from there.
S.
- Sat Feb 24, 2007 12:19 pm
- Forum: TTF Archives / TTF Archives / Creation and Performance / Trombonists
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Man, your playing in the upper register reminds me of Slide on his octet recordings. Very powerful and solid, but still sweet. I mean that with the greatest respect for both of you. Glad we could all check that out.
Glad to have at least a little evidence of what I have been up to. Something to share with others.
Really.
QuoteNow how do you feel about this thread?
DG
This thread?
Unraveled?
S.
- Sat Feb 24, 2007 10:36 am
- Forum: TTF Archives / TTF Archives / Creation and Performance / Trombonists
- Topic:
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LORD ALMIGHTY!!!!
I had NO IDEA that was made into a video. Thank you SO much!!!
Can't find Cleve Pozar...haven't been able to do a thing with that CD.
All the trombones...that's all me. Played a small axe (Conn Burkle 32H), a .525/.547 and bass. I wrote the chart, too.
Drums? Cleve Pozar...one of my oldest friends...on Santeria ritual drums called bata.
Nice to hear it again.
John Coltrane and West African-influenced Caribbean ritual drum styles.
Not a bad place to start, eh?
Thanks again, slideorama.
I owe you one.
Sam
- Sat Feb 24, 2007 8:02 am
- Forum: TTF Archives / TTF Archives / Creation and Performance / Trombonists
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Did you happen to see Pat Metheny's words of tribute to Michael Brecker from the other night at Town Hall? I don't know how, but somehow I thought it might relate here, even expand the discussion.
Peace and groove,
No.
I missed the service. Had to work.
What did he say?
S.
- Fri Feb 23, 2007 9:06 pm
- Forum: TTF Archives / TTF Archives / Creation and Performance / Trombonists
- Topic:
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Damn it Sam are you ever wrong????
Well...I DID choose the trombone...
- Fri Feb 23, 2007 9:02 pm
- Forum: TTF Archives / TTF Archives / Creation and Performance / Trombonists
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---snip---
Nice post, Sam. There are new names to me on your "short list". Can you tell me/us more about:
Andrae Murchison, Jose Davila, Jeff Bush, Nate Mayland, Deion Tucker....I think I'm familiar with the rest of this choice list.
Cheers,
Andrae Murchison...maybe 20 years old?
Just up from Atlanta. Young, but BIG ears. Playing the real stuff. Wide open to everything. Big horn, big sound player.
Jose Davila...been around a while. Plays tenor, bass + tuba. A FINE, expressive soloist on all of them. In all idioms.
Jeff Bush...went to Manhattan School of music. Fairly young, but has roots that go right back to the swing players. Plays the HELL out of the instrument.
Nate Mayland...graduated from Indiana. Plays 2 1/2 and 3 octave lines. On a 3B. Right on up from the second partial. Makes it sound easy. Connected!!! I have NO idea how he does it, except that's what he practices and he practices a lot. Great notes, too.
Deion Tucker...a real, grown-up young mainstream jazz player…
- Fri Feb 23, 2007 7:39 am
- Forum: TTF Archives / TTF Archives / Creation and Performance / Trombonists
- Topic:
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It illustrates precisely why so many of us are asking about the continued relevance of the trombone.
I would guess some 95% of the clips that have been recommended here are of interest ONLY to trombonists. Not even particularly to other brass players, probably not to other musicians, and almost CERTAINLY not to simple listeners and lovers of music.
ESPECIALLY the "jazz" clips.
As a technically interested trombonist...there is a great deal of good stuff.
As a musician/composer/musical philosopher? (Sorry...I do not know how else to describe my interest in the music of music.)
Sad stuff, most of it.
Licks by the carload.
Surrender to the instrument.
ESPECIALLY the "fast guys".
Most of the solos? Illustrations of why there are so few trombone solos written into charts or featured on recordings OTHER than those made by trombonists in the interests of self-promotion.
The only stuff that comes across as "music" as opposed to trombone athletics?
The usual pantheon of greats.
In order of age:
Teagarden
Trummy Young
Dorsey
Bill Harris
…
- Fri Aug 16, 2013 5:37 am
- Forum: TTF Archives / TTF Archives / Horns, Gear, and Equipment / Instruments
- Topic:
Trombonist who fly with trombone on a regular basis--attn!!!! - Replies: 375
- Views: 166892
Trombonist who fly with trombone on a regular basis--attn!!!!
QuoteSometimes it's best to just take the gate check tag, put it in your pocket, and carry your horn on the plane.
And Jeb writes:
QuoteDoug: I actually tried that this time, but the guy made me leave it with him at the top of the jet bridge, instead of dropping it off right before getting on the plane.
Here's the deal.
The corporate world is our enemy, almost everywhere. We do something that is not common, and corporate clones...on any and every level...are in the business of "the middle." Why? 'Cuz that's where the money is. Duh.
Ok...what to do, what to do?
Fool 'em every chance you get and cover your rear end when you can't fool 'em.
As follows:
1-Be sure to put your horn in a case that is airplane and...hopefully... TSA proof. I use an SKB Universal case for my tenors. If I travelled w/a bass I'd use an SKB golf case and check it into luggage.
2-Try to get the early clones...the ones at the check-in procedure...to let you gate check it. If they absolutely, positively will not, insist on watching the TSA inspection procedure. Otherwise the TSA minimum…
- Fri Jul 19, 2013 9:50 am
- Forum: TTF Archives / TTF Archives / Horns, Gear, and Equipment / Instruments
- Topic:
Trombonist who fly with trombone on a regular basis--attn!!!! - Replies: 375
- Views: 166892
Trombonist who fly with trombone on a regular basis--attn!!!!
US Musicians should probably contact their senators and reps to encourage them to encourage the new
Until the regulations are issued the airlines can still make their own policies.
From the linked file above:
Quote...the new FAA rules wont go into effect until final regulations have been issued, which, according to the bill, will be no later than two years after the date of enactment.
Gotta love this great country, don'tcha? The report is dated "FEBRUARY 1, 2012.Ordered to be printed." It was "passed"...signed, sealed and delivered...through Obama's desk on 2/16/12.
And yet..."...the Transportation Department has not yet issued the actual regulations to the airlines. It's…
- Sat Jan 01, 2011 12:51 pm
- Forum: TTF Archives / TTF Archives / Horns, Gear, and Equipment / Instruments
- Topic:
Trombonist who fly with trombone on a regular basis--attn!!!! - Replies: 375
- Views: 166892
Trombonist who fly with trombone on a regular basis--attn!!!!
From Edward Solomon, A fine Brit trombonist. 8,657 members and counting. Join.
S.
- Fri Dec 24, 2010 4:30 pm
- Forum: TTF Archives / TTF Archives / Horns, Gear, and Equipment / Instruments
- Topic:
Trombonist who fly with trombone on a regular basis--attn!!!! - Replies: 375
- Views: 166892
Trombonist who fly with trombone on a regular basis--attn!!!!
S.
P.S. Sorry...I couldn't resist.
Merry Christmas
- Tue May 04, 2010 9:33 am
- Forum: TTF Archives / TTF Archives / Horns, Gear, and Equipment / Instruments
- Topic:
Trombonist who fly with trombone on a regular basis--attn!!!! - Replies: 375
- Views: 166892
Trombonist who fly with trombone on a regular basis--attn!!!!
Best way, if it's packed well. But...expensive.
S.
- Tue May 04, 2010 9:30 am
- Forum: TTF Archives / TTF Archives / Horns, Gear, and Equipment / Instruments
- Topic:
Trombonist who fly with trombone on a regular basis--attn!!!! - Replies: 375
- Views: 166892
Trombonist who fly with trombone on a regular basis--attn!!!!
Due to checked bag fees, people are now carrying on more than ever before. Planes are having their overheads filled before the plane is 1/2 boarded. They now are doing mass "Thru-gate-checks". This is where a standard "checked bag" tag is applied to your bag at the gate. YOUR BAG WILL NOT BE RETURNED TO YOU AT THE DOOR ON ARRIVAL IF THIS HAPPENS.... you'll have to go to the regular luggage carousel to claim it.
Make sure that you ask for a gate check tag (and use this term) "like the strollers get" so your horn is returned to you at the plane door by hand. It is a separate "special" tag. From their reaction (a positive one) when I identified my carry-on as an instrument, it seems there is some policy/memo re:instruments and their eligibility for this "stroller" gate-check.
FWIW, they were "thru-checking" all carry-ons, no exceptions (their words) except for strollers and my horn. Fortunately I didn't have…
- Tue May 04, 2010 8:14 am
- Forum: TTF Archives / TTF Archives / Horns, Gear, and Equipment / Instruments
- Topic:
Trombonist who fly with trombone on a regular basis--attn!!!! - Replies: 375
- Views: 166892
Trombonist who fly with trombone on a regular basis--attn!!!!
what is "gate check" any way?
what advantage does that get you?
Gatecheck:
You have brought the instrument through security yourself. It has been X-rayed (and possibly pawed over) by our ever-so-nice nice Homeboy Security people in your full sight. Most often even if they do get itchy paws, once they have decided that it is not a rocket launcher or whatever else their overheated, media-fueled imaginations might come up with you can re-pack it yourself correctly. Then you walk it down the entrance tunnel. If you're slick...I use a raincoat over the case which is itself over my shoulder on the opposite side of upcoming watchers, and also I try to walk fairly closely behind the biggest person I can find....you will get past all of the tunnel trolls and into the airplane. If you have been both smart and early, you will have booked a seat towards the rear of the plane, which means that you will be among the first people boarded and thus will have any number of possible overheads at your disposal. As long as…
- Tue May 04, 2010 7:17 am
- Forum: TTF Archives / TTF Archives / Horns, Gear, and Equipment / Instruments
- Topic:
Trombonist who fly with trombone on a regular basis--attn!!!! - Replies: 375
- Views: 166892
Trombonist who fly with trombone on a regular basis--attn!!!!
I bet you could fight with the airlines over what the "bolded" language means
Yeah, but...
Fighting with corporations is like fighting a horde of octopi. Every time you cut off a tentacle, dozens more appear. Ain't about, right or wrong, it's just about expense and trouble.
Best idea? Get the smallest, strongest case that you can buy and try to hustle the case onto the plane. Do whatever you must...get there early, chat up the gatekeepers, doubletalk, tapdance, evade, conceal...whatever it takes. And then gatecheck it if all else fails.
Expense and trouble? That's the minimum.
Fight w/the airlines?
Endless. And bad odds, too. Bet on it.
Trick 'em instead.
S.
- Sun Dec 27, 2009 5:59 am
- Forum: TTF Archives / TTF Archives / Horns, Gear, and Equipment / Instruments
- Topic:
Trombonist who fly with trombone on a regular basis--attn!!!! - Replies: 375
- Views: 166892
Trombonist who fly with trombone on a regular basis--attn!!!!
I don't have trips scheduled, but it always follows.
Bet on it.
One carry-on, according to many news reports.
What'll it be?
The horn or my non-losable belongings?
The horn or my food...defensive food, seeing as how the stuff served on most airlines is not only awful tasting but laced with so many chemicals I sometimes think that it could be ignited and used as a terrorist weapon.
The horn or my books and laptop that I use to while away the endless flight hours because the movies they show are as poisonous as is the food and the seats are so small, so cramped and so contiguous to the restlessness of others in the same situation that sleep is not an option.
UH oh!!!
Good thing I didn't sell my golf cases.
Ain't getting any better, that's for sure.
The hatred…
- Thu Jul 03, 2014 5:27 am
- Forum: TTF Archives / TTF Archives / Horns, Gear, and Equipment / Mouthpieces
- Topic:
Mouthpiece Confusion - Replies: 98
- Views: 32167
Mouthpiece Confusion
Two ideas:
1-The ideal rim size for any player has to do with his or her facial physiognomy...teeth size and shape, lip size, overbite/underbite etc. When the aperture needs more room to expand for low notes than is allowed by the rim diameter, then a "shift" is needed. Ditto the other way. Too large a rim diameter will not help to support someone's naturally smaller aperture that works quite well in the low range.
2-Most low range problems are caused by a lack of resistance from behind the m'pce...in the embouchure and in the use of the tongue as a sort of air nozzle. Smaller equipment provides the missing resistance. Once one develops real embouchure strength and balance in the low registers then the small equipment crutch is no longer needed.
S.
- Thu Nov 03, 2016 8:53 pm
- Forum: TTF Archives / TTF Archives / Horns, Gear, and Equipment / Mouthpieces
- Topic:
And who in their right mind chooses ANY mouthpiece? Plus how to choose, as well. - Replies: 62
- Views: 24207
And who in their right mind chooses ANY mouthpiece? Plus how to choose, as well.
Then I begin to wonder about one thing. Is this method really fair. Because most of us play best on the gear we are used to play. Even if we try to confuse our lips with playing many mouthpieces, wouldn't the one we played for a long period sound best? I can fool my lips in a blindtest so I dont recognize which mouthpiece is which. Still I wonder if the one we are used to play, still will sound best? What do you think?
Leif
Not for me, Leif. Not often, but once in a while...years in between sometimes...one m'pce that I have been using for years comes in second to a new one. Why? My own chop changes? Simply a better fit to my own ongoing and basically unchanged embouchure? Differing musical…
- Thu Sep 06, 2007 7:27 pm
- Forum: TTF Archives / TTF Archives / Horns, Gear, and Equipment / Mouthpieces
- Topic:
And who in their right mind chooses ANY mouthpiece? Plus how to choose, as well. - Replies: 62
- Views: 24207
And who in their right mind chooses ANY mouthpiece? Plus how to choose, as well.
Cheers,
M
Or...there's another can of worms closed up.
How?
Do not worry about "the gap". OR turbulence. Simply find the right m'pce depth...right for YOU...and go on about your business.
I'm my OWN wind tunnel.
You can be, too.
S.
- Thu Sep 06, 2007 7:24 pm
- Forum: TTF Archives / TTF Archives / Horns, Gear, and Equipment / Mouthpieces
- Topic:
And who in their right mind chooses ANY mouthpiece? Plus how to choose, as well. - Replies: 62
- Views: 24207
And who in their right mind chooses ANY mouthpiece? Plus how to choose, as well.
I should heve been more specific.
They did NOT "suck". They played very well when matched with Olds horns. But they FELT like they sucked when played with other horns, and thus they also felt strange compared to the mainstream Bach-ish m'pces to which most of us had grown accustomed.
So...the horns didn't play well with other brands of m'pces, and the m'pces that DID make them play well felt...well, they felt foreign, to put it mildly.
Thus...the horns never got as popular as they might have gotten.
A self-fulfilling, Catch-22 kind of prophecy.
Better?
---snip---
-Ben
[/quote]
- Wed Sep 05, 2007 10:28 am
- Forum: TTF Archives / TTF Archives / Horns, Gear, and Equipment / Mouthpieces
- Topic:
And who in their right mind chooses ANY mouthpiece? Plus how to choose, as well. - Replies: 62
- Views: 24207
And who in their right mind chooses ANY mouthpiece? Plus how to choose, as well.
Where else could I learn about the difference in King leadpipes? I wonder if that does give 2B/3B's that distinctive sound... must be more than the curved brace, right?
Olds horns open a whole 'nother can of kickass. They used a different taper in their receivers and what that decision essentially guaranteed is that only their m'pces fit right. AND...their m'pces sucked. Which is one reason why Olds horns never became as popular as their quality suggested they should become among serious pros.
Have fun trying, though...
Once again…
- Wed Sep 05, 2007 10:23 am
- Forum: TTF Archives / TTF Archives / Horns, Gear, and Equipment / Mouthpieces
- Topic:
And who in their right mind chooses ANY mouthpiece? Plus how to choose, as well. - Replies: 62
- Views: 24207
And who in their right mind chooses ANY mouthpiece? Plus how to choose, as well.
Chris Stearn.
Yeah but...what does it DO???
Provided of course that:
A-The width of the metal at the opening at the end of the m'pce and that of the step at the end of the receiver are exactly the same.
B-The m'pce actually goes in far enough so that it does butt up against said step.
and
C-That depth is the proper one for the m'pce/horn/player interface.
A lotta ifs there…
- Wed Sep 05, 2007 7:40 am
- Forum: TTF Archives / TTF Archives / Horns, Gear, and Equipment / Mouthpieces
- Topic:
And who in their right mind chooses ANY mouthpiece? Plus how to choose, as well. - Replies: 62
- Views: 24207
And who in their right mind chooses ANY mouthpiece? Plus how to choose, as well.
Later...S.
Most, if not all, the earlier Kings and some of the new ones have a two piece leadpipe.
There is an actual mouthpiece receiver that is soldered onto the leadpipe, and then inserted into the upper tube.
I think the 2 & 3B's now are the only ones made as such.
Makes it a little more difficult to pull the pipe when requested.
Eric
Hmmm...
Does anyone have any ideas about how that procedure affects and/or p[roduces the typical King sound and blow?
Classic 2Bs and 3Bs?
I have noticed that any number of manufacturers make horns that are relatively Conn or Bach-like, but only Kings are really Kings. In those models, anyway.
S.
- Wed Sep 05, 2007 7:38 am
- Forum: TTF Archives / TTF Archives / Horns, Gear, and Equipment / Mouthpieces
- Topic:
And who in their right mind chooses ANY mouthpiece? Plus how to choose, as well. - Replies: 62
- Views: 24207
And who in their right mind chooses ANY mouthpiece? Plus how to choose, as well.
Go check out the other one as well, Erling.
12 pages of interesting stuff.
Sam
- Wed Sep 05, 2007 6:43 am
- Forum: TTF Archives / TTF Archives / Horns, Gear, and Equipment / Mouthpieces
- Topic:
And who in their right mind chooses ANY mouthpiece? Plus how to choose, as well. - Replies: 62
- Views: 24207
And who in their right mind chooses ANY mouthpiece? Plus how to choose, as well.
Well, if you are a basically non-experimentinmg player who basically uses only one m'pce, you can have a good brass tech custom match your chosen m'pce with your chosen leadpipe once you have found the ideal depth that you want to use. But my whole life seems to be an ongoing experiment, so I have never gotten around to doing that. I am thinking about doing it with my .525 Shires/NY Bach Clarke S and .500 Shires/NY 11C combinations, but to tell you the truth since I do play so many different setups I have almost no reliable "feel memory", to coin a term. That is, I adjust very quickly to equipment changes and thus have to A/B equipment within a minute or so of each other or I get lost in the forests of possibilities and physical memory and thus probably won't be able to accurately compare the two feels..
I'll do it eventually.
Any day now.
Aaaaany day now...
- Tue Sep 04, 2007 8:19 pm
- Forum: TTF Archives / TTF Archives / Horns, Gear, and Equipment / Mouthpieces
- Topic:
And who in their right mind chooses ANY mouthpiece? Plus how to choose, as well. - Replies: 62
- Views: 24207
And who in their right mind chooses ANY mouthpiece? Plus how to choose, as well.
The point of my initial post has been missed.
I wasn't saying that NY or Mt Vernon mouthpieces weren't good (they most cetainly can be fantastic), but that consistency was not a strong point of this era. The point about "rose coloured glasses" was aimed at the people who believe that every one of these mouthpieces was a "holy grail".
Having owned several of various sizes, (including one 4G that was "Very" individual)I feel I have some basis for the opinion. But it's just that, my opinion....
My post was not put up in opposition to yours.
Just as a commentary on the whole idea of m'pce and equipment choice.
It "got me to thinking".
Thanks.
S.
- Tue Sep 04, 2007 5:19 pm
- Forum: TTF Archives / TTF Archives / Horns, Gear, and Equipment / Mouthpieces
- Topic:
And who in their right mind chooses ANY mouthpiece? Plus how to choose, as well. - Replies: 62
- Views: 24207
And who in their right mind chooses ANY mouthpiece? Plus how to choose, as well.
I always thought metal on metal is better than having some foreign material between the mpc and leadpipe.
Not in my experience.
LOTS of it.
30+ years and counting since I started doing this.
The DEPTH is the thing.
Listen...
So there you are with a leadpipe receiver. Soldered in or not.
And you put a m'pce in it that you have been told has the right taper for the receiver.
For almost ALL receivers. (How's THAT for a corporate myth, by the way?)
I don't believe it.
What if the taper(s) are off? Either or both. Have you SEEN what's working on the assembly lines at some major manufacturers? Lawnmower blade grinders. Bet on it. What if at the end of your m'pce there is a gap between the lip of the shank and the wall of the receiver? What then? What if on an older horn or m'pce the receiver or…
- Tue Sep 04, 2007 5:17 pm
- Forum: TTF Archives / TTF Archives / Horns, Gear, and Equipment / Mouthpieces
- Topic:
And who in their right mind chooses ANY mouthpiece? Plus how to choose, as well. - Replies: 62
- Views: 24207
And who in their right mind chooses ANY mouthpiece? Plus how to choose, as well.
Plumber's tape? That just seems like you've added a completely new factor in whether or not that piece plays well. What if you added too much tape? What if it's too high or too low on the mouthpiece? Do you think you've ever thrown out a piece because it didn't play well, when in actuality it didn't play well because you toyed with the function/design? I am really quite curious. BTW, how/why did you come up with applying tape to the mouthpiece in the first place?
I found long ago that as much as 1/16" difference in how far the shank of a m'pce enters the receiver makes a huge difference in how that combination plays. I started by buffing my m'pce shanks down until they went into the receiver too far and then building them back up again until I hit a sweet spot. Now, since…
- Tue Sep 04, 2007 7:11 am
- Forum: TTF Archives / TTF Archives / Horns, Gear, and Equipment / Mouthpieces
- Topic:
And who in their right mind chooses ANY mouthpiece? Plus how to choose, as well. - Replies: 62
- Views: 24207
And who in their right mind chooses ANY mouthpiece? Plus how to choose, as well.
I've never been disciplined enough to do the blindfold method, but I probably should.
---snip---
Discipline?
WHAT discipline?
You line up a bunch of m'ces, play them, eliminate the ones that work least well until you come up with the one that best suits your playing at that moment (A moment, by the way, that should be when you are in passably good playing shape. In the kind of shape in which you normally live and work, anyway.), and then you play it for a few weeks.
If it doesn't work out, you go back to your other m'pce...provided of course that you haven't chosen "your" m'pce in the blindfold test, which happens more and more often as you refine your act...and play it until you have another practical reason to try switching.
AIN'T no discipline involved. Not as much as you need to practice regularly and well, anyway.
Try it.
You'll learn something. Even if what you learn is that it doesn't work for you.
- Tue Sep 04, 2007 6:25 am
- Forum: TTF Archives / TTF Archives / Horns, Gear, and Equipment / Mouthpieces
- Topic:
And who in their right mind chooses ANY mouthpiece? Plus how to choose, as well. - Replies: 62
- Views: 24207
And who in their right mind chooses ANY mouthpiece? Plus how to choose, as well.
I find it interesting that people have this "rose coloured glasses" view of NY and Mt Vernon Bach product. That they are the "Holy Grail".
That contrasts with the widely help belief that, as stated by Sam Burtis, and echoed by many others, "if you want a custom mounthpiece, line up a dozen Bach's and find the one you like". Sam, I believe, was talking about the Mt Vernon and early Elkhart era. Consistency was not something that was a big selling point for Bach in those days. The way the pieces were made didn't allow for anything like the consistency achieved today with CNC lathes, as used by almost every mouthpiece maker out there, including Bach.
When I was at the shop last week I was shown the safe that holds all the mouthpieces, hand selected by Mr Bach himself, that represent "exactly" what each of the models was supposed to be like, according to Mr Bach. Each of those pieces was digitised and that info was used to program the CNC machines…
- Mon Aug 02, 2010 11:07 pm
- Forum: TTF Archives / TTF Archives / Creation and Performance / The Business of Music
- Topic:
Freelance Trombone Playing Query - Replies: 65
- Views: 192871
Freelance Trombone Playing Query
Sorry.
Lots of good info here.
My own story?
I am the most "freelance" musician that I know in NYC. On any axe. Never took a Broadway show, never had a regular, day-in-day-out gig, including teaching. 40 years and counting.
My one, main rule? No matter how dumb the music, always play your instrument as if every note was important. Make every note mean something even if it only means something to you.
Main rule #2?
Do not do work that interferes with rule #1.
Now...implementng that second rule can be a very subjective and personal thing. I myself cannot stay even borderline sane on most B'way show gigs, and the club date scene makes me almost suicidal. A gig here, a gig there? Sure. Every week for months? No way.
Other really fine players find those kinds of gigs not so unpleasant, and still others crank their way through those scenes despite how unhappy they may be. Everyone has certain financial parameters that they must meet...family, etc...and people do what they think that they must do in order to survive. Long term, as far as I am concerned? If a gig hurts your playing, it's not worth doing.
- Mon Aug 03, 2009 1:03 pm
- Forum: TTF Archives / TTF Archives / Horns, Gear, and Equipment / Instruments
- Topic:
Earl Williams Trombone - Replies: 1761
- Views: 1732919
Earl Williams Trombone
Probably doesn't know his alt. scales.
S.
- Thu Jul 09, 2009 9:35 am
- Forum: TTF Archives / TTF Archives / Horns, Gear, and Equipment / Instruments
- Topic:
Earl Williams Trombone - Replies: 1761
- Views: 1732919
Earl Williams Trombone
I am not at all sure that this was so much "Earl's idea" and not just the way things were in LA when he began his career. When he first started making horns under his own name in the mid '20s/early '30s they were "Wallace-Williams" horns. Every one that I have seen has a relatively small bell and either a .525-ish or .547 slide, often with TIS as well. Spike Williams was the principal trombonist in the LA Philharmonic. I assume that he did some movie recording work as well...it was the '30s and most movie soundtracks were kind of old-school "symphonic" in approach...but his main gig was w/the LA Phil. Small bells generally project better than do larger ones.,..more focus...and somewhat brighten the sound. Their efficacy in live situations has been well proven to me many times, including gigs that…
- Mon Jun 08, 2009 12:08 pm
- Forum: TTF Archives / TTF Archives / Horns, Gear, and Equipment / Instruments
- Topic:
Earl Williams Trombone - Replies: 1761
- Views: 1732919
Earl Williams Trombone
Sam,
Thanks for the great input.
I'm going to go out on a limb here and assume that you liked the Williams because of its sound. "Real singers," you said. (I'm not sure what a singer is.) You also referred to the "Williams feel." My personal definition of feel is how easily I can make a horn produce the variety of sounds that are in my head, and how well the horn gives me feedback to verify my efforts. Is this what you like about the Williams feel?
Somewhere in the archives of this forum, there is a post where you said that the trombone is a clumsy instrument, not well suited to rapid articulations. All we have is our sound. Is that what the Williams is all about? Its sound?
Sound, attacks, feedback...especially feedback...easy, open blow (thus easy rapid articulation) and projection were the reasons that I liked (and continue to like) Earl Williams horns.
Why not continue to play one?
Well, number one I wanted a little more mass of sound. A little more density. remember, I was playing lead with Tito Puente and Tito-style big bands then as a large…
- Mon Jun 08, 2009 7:08 am
- Forum: TTF Archives / TTF Archives / Horns, Gear, and Equipment / Instruments
- Topic:
Earl Williams Trombone - Replies: 1761
- Views: 1732919
Earl Williams Trombone
Jack Teagrden: Played just about every horn - the Williams bein gonly one of many. To my ear, Jack Teagarden did not sound his best on the Williams. (based on available recordings)
Billy Byers: Also a Bach player
It seems that many players toyed with the Williams horns but all switched to other instruments.
They were nice horns.
Some were good.
Some were dogs.
Cult status?
Nope.
Just a nicely built trombone with its' own unique quirkiness.
Hary
As you must.
No great horns work for everyone, all of the time.
I have owned...besides my Shires horns that I basically put together so that they would fit my varying needs...about 5 horns that I have considered "great" instruments.
A '30s Conn 78H Special.
A gold plated Mt. Vernon 16 that had been converted to single bore…